MINUTES OF THIRTEENTH MEETING, DCI SECURITY FORUM, 14 NOVEMBER 1987

• Document Type: CREST
• Collection: General CIA Records
• Document Number (FOIA) /ESDN (CREST): CIA-RDP89M00699R001000650004-4
• Release Decision: RIPPUB
• Original Classification: C
• Document Page Count: 8
• Document Creation Date: December 27, 2016
• Document Release Date: March 5, 2013
• Sequence Number: 4
• Publication Date: November 18, 1987
• Content Type: MEMO

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9-4.-TEty.
CO TIAL
The Director of Central Intelligence
Intelligence Community Staff
MEMORANDUM FOR THE RECORD
FROM: Executive Secretary
DCI Security Forum
VVashington,IIC 20505
DCl/ICS 0986-87
18 November 1987
SUBJECT: Minutes of Thirteenth Meeting, DCI Security
14 November 1927
--147-17-6-777S7
1. The following is a record of events that took place at the DCI
Security Forum meeting on 16 November 1987 in Room 6100, Main Justice, from
1300-1435 hours. Attendees were those persons identified below. All agencies
and departments were represented.
D/CCISCMO/ICS
George Alvarez, Marine Corps
Eugene Walsh, FBI
CIA
DIA
CIA
Maynard Anderson, OSD
Edward J. Pollard, Treasury
Gene Bacher, DoE
Bill O'Donnell, Treasury
Mark Pelensky, Navy
James R. Linnen, Army
James Barron, Army ,
2. The meeting opened with the
19 October 1987 meeting.
NSA
CCISCMO
William C. Cody, AF/INS
Maurice Ralston, OSD, C3I
CIA/OGC
CIA
John Lewis, NSC
CCISCMO
Tom Chace, State
George Henriksen, Navy
Jerry Rubino, Justice
Kenneth Lopez, State
NSA
members' acceptance of the minutes
of the
3. Chief, Special Security Center/CIA, was introduced and he
proceeded with a presentation on the Community-wide, Computer-assisted
Compartmentation Control System, commonly known and referred to as the 4C
System. Bob traced the history of the system from origin to the present and
he touched on the projected development into the next phase of the system's
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SUBJECT: Minutes of Thirteenth Meeting, DCI Security Forum,
16 November 1987
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functioning (expansion into the unified and specified commands of the military
overseas). Cited were some of the difficulties encountered in the development
of the system, including funding, hardware, software, and legal issues were
cited. While all were overcome, one problem repeats periodically and is
looming ominous again. That problem is funding. Bob cited what services the
system can provide, what information is contained in, and what can be obtained
from the system. Participants in the system were identified and, at present,
only DIA and NSA of the NFIB principals were lacking in entering their full
data into the system. (This does not restrict those agencies from querying
and obtaining information from the data base.)
Terms and definitions were given and, while no recounting of
presentation is attempted here, some of his pertinent facts and figures are
reported. There are now 91,131 records in the archives, which is important to
all of us. Over 730 accesses of a wide variety are recorded, and the system
has the capability to record an infinite number. Another important point is
that any category of accesses can be suppressed, i.e., visible only to the
owner or sponsor.
ACTION ITEM
is to explore with his programmers and the 4C working group
if, and under what conditions, a terminal could be provided for DIS, as well
as the cost of such an action. He will have answers for us in time for the
next meeting (14 December 1987).
4. remarked that written comments were due on the personal
liability amendment to the NSA Act of 1947. Mr. Anderson, speaking for the
services, said their responses were in the process of coordination, i.e.,
review and approval by his supervisor and their appropriate legal officials.
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SUBJECT: Minutes of Thirteenth Meeting, DCI Security Forum,
16 November 1987
Treasury, NSA, and Justice submitted written comments. Mr. Rubino commented
on the Justice Department position (in favor of but need not be limited to the
Intelligence Community), and included in his statement was the Justice
position of concurrence along with uncertainty of just how to best approach
the matter in the legal proposal. One suggested approach, based on successful
experience, was that perhaps each agency should attempt to obtain the
liability exemption for themselves, independent of a group or blanket effort.
George Henriksen of Navy stated that they had been working with Jack Farley of
Justice on this issue. While Farley reportedly agrees that a remedy of some
sort must be obtained to brotect the employee, he is not offering optimism for
accomplishment, said he sees this matter stuck in studious
inertia, and he thought we should move actively and positively.
commented, and one item of note, was his rhetorical question about where do we
get the money for legal indemnification. He also thought we should try to
package the issue and play it out. He thought that the climate and timing was
right to attempt to sell the issue as a sort of CI type of protection for the
government, reiterating his desire to move forward, asked if
all members agreed. There were no objections to his proposition, and
was appointed as the action officer. accepted, saying he would
try to get something appropriate into the Intelligence Authorization Bill.
called on members to support the action with any contributions,
conceptual or otherwise, by contacting commented to John
Lewis of NSC that it was important to get the key personalities at NSC attuned
to the issue and again their support. John acknowledged and agreed.
ACTION ITEM
will advise the group of progress in his efforts when the
Forum meets again in December.
5. asked for an accounting relative to which
agencies/departments were delinquent in submitting written statements asked
for at earlier meetings. Those issues, and the agencies that have not
responded are:
a. Retention of Personnel Security Record Information - DoE, State,
FBI.
b. Passage/Exchange of Unfavorable Personnel Security Information -
DoE, State, Justice, DIA.
c. Personal Liability Amendment to NSA Act of 1947 - OSD, DoE,
State, FBI.
closed this portion of the meeting by asking that members
PLEASE send in the delinquent statements to the Executive Secretary as soon as
they can.
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SUBJECT: Minutes of Thirteenth Meeting, DCI Security Forum,
16 November 1987
6. The next item was a proposal for consideration by Navy, with Mark
Pelensky distributing a memorandum for all members (copy attached). Mark
emphasized that this was merely conceptual, but he urged that the Forum
seriously consider some actions outlined in the memorandum in order to achieve
unanimity in notification (of adverse personnel security actions), procedures
following the action which affect other agencies/departments, and procedures
to resolve different views on the same matter. Mark pointed out that we are
currently lacking uniformity in the areas addressed and that we as a Community
could appear disorganized and at least less than professional under close
scrutiny because of the disparity in treating some adverse action cases. This
subject generated considerable discussion and commentary and is clearly a
matter of high interest. One of the Navy proposals called for consideration
of a daily review of an adverse or unfavorable action list that would be
contained in the 4C System. This would help the standardization of the timely
notification aspect of the "problem." Other parts of the proposal would be
for all other agencies to honor the actions of other agencies pending the
appeal process (if any) to final resolution. Legal, procedural and sarochial
interests were cited in comments as applicable to this matter.
ACTION ITEM
All members were asked to review and reflect on the Navy memorandum and
proposals. was asked to get together with his 4C System
programmers and provide a time and cost estimate for accomplishing the
suggested "adverse action list." agreed that there was a valid
need to fix what appears to be a weakness in the "system," at least in the
first step of notification to others of adverse action. This matter will be .
discussed again at the December meeting.
7. CAPT Pelensky next informed the group about a recent situation wherein
it appeared that a Navy SCIF might be subject to inspection (by Soviets) under
terms of the INF treaty. While there was initial cause for some concern and
the matter was one of interest to the group, it became apparent after comments
by Messrs. Anderson and that we need not be overly concerned yet.
The terms of the treaty are still being formulated, and it is expected that we
would have sufficient time to adjust our positions (and SCIFs) if necessary
after we know more about the conditions of the proposed treaty.
8. Mr. Anderson announced that an error was detected in the DoD
Industrial Security Manual DoD 5220.22-M, Section IX, Paragraph 75e. This
portion states "Denial or revocation of authorization for access to SENSITIVE
COMPARTMENTED INFORMATION is not appealable." Mr. Anderson said he had
written a memo to the Director of DIS requesting a notification of the error
be published with a corrected statement referencing DCID 1/14 relative to the
appeal process.
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9. then provided commentary on some pending legislation. He 25X1
cited the proposed "Specter bill" that would split the DCI (not a new concept)
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SUBJECT: Minutes of Thirteenth Meeting, DCI Security Forum,
16 November 1987
into two positions, one DCI for political policy as the Director of National
Intelligence in the NSC structure, and the other as Director of CIA for
authority in solely parochial CIA matters. opined that this bill is
not viewed as having much support. Included in this bill is a proposal for
penalties for lying to Congress, making it a specific crime (with a 5-day
period for correction of testimony). This does have some support. Another
provision would create a statutory Inspector General for CIA. noted
that Judge Webster opposes this, and there is considerable effort to prevent
this provision from proceeding. It could be separated from the bill,
added. Three other pending bills were briefly mentioned and are even more
briefly noted here.
Boren/Cohen Bill - Would require notification to Congress by the
President of any covert actions approved and/or undertaken. thought
there could be considerable contention on this.
Byrd Bill - Would limit the DCI's term of office to seven years. At
the present time, the term is indefinite.
Glenn Bill - Would involve the GAO in intelligence activity now
limited by specific language. The bill would change the language,
enlarging the GAO jurisdiction, and permit the Comptroller General to
become "involved" in all intelligence activities, said there does
not appear to be any clear support for this yet and the SSCI is opposed
due to infringement on its territory.
10. The meeting adjourned at 1435 hours. The next meeting and final one
for CY 1987 is scheduled for 14 December at 1300 hours, Room 6100, Main
Justice. Members are asked to call at CCISCMO,
not later that COB 11 December 1987. The agenda for the next
meeting will be provided separately. Members with agenda items are asked to
call the Executive Secretary for their inclusion.
Attachment:
a/s
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SUBJECT: Minutes of Thirteenth Meeting, DCI Security Forum,
16 November 1987
CCISCMO/ICS
Distribution of DCl/ICS 0986-87:
Maynard C. Anderson, OSD
Maurice Ralston, OSD
Richard F. Williams, OSD
James R. Linnen, Army
James D. Passarelli, Army
James P. Barron, Army
George Henriksen, Navy
William C. Cody, Air Force
Ted Konduris, Air Force
Mark Pelensky, Navy
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Walter J. Breede, Martne
George L. Alvarez, Mari,ne
Corps
Corps
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DI4k
DIA'
NSA
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NSA,
.
Gary L. Stoops,
FBI
Clark M. Dittmer, State
Thomas W. Chace, State
Kenneth E. Lopez, State
John Lewis, NSC
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CIA
CIA
CIA
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CIA
Jerry Rubino, Justice
Bernard Gattozzi, Justice
Stephen E. Bacher, DoE
Edward J. Pollard, Treasury
William B. O'Donnell, Treasury
ICS Registry
CCISCMO subject
D/CCISCMO chrono
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From:
To:
Via:
DEPARTMENT OF THE NAVY
NAVAL INTELLIGENCE COMMAND
4600 SILVER HILL ROAD
WASHINGTON. D.C. 20389-5000
Alternate Navy Member, DCI Security Forum
The Chairman, DCI Security Forum
Navy Member, DCI Security Forum
IN REPLY REFER TO
13 Nov 87
Subj: SCI COMMUNITY POLICY ON UNFAVORABLE SCI ELIGIBILITY ACTIONS
(Frame of Reference: Unfavorable SCI eligibility actions
(abreviated as unfavorable actions) for purposes of this paper,
are those taken against an individual with a current SCI
eligibility determination or with SCI access, which result in the
suspension, revocation or denial of the eligibility or the
access.)
1. Discussion
At the present time there exists no formal requirement for
notification of the SCI Community agencies of unfavorable actions
taken by a member agency, nor is there a uniform procedure to
effect such notification. Additionally, there is no method to
resolve differences of opinion about a subject's continued
eligibility in instances where two or more agencies have
cognizance over that subject's SCI access. A recent Navy case
involving a contractor graphically illustrated the problems that
the above cited inadequacy can create, and argues strongly in
support of formalizing SCI community inter-agency notification of
unfavorable actions, and developing appropriate procedures to do
so. Lacking such procedures, the SCI community appears to be
fragmented with little or no uniform application of the standards
for determining SCI eligibility, and suggests (incorrectly so)
inadequate internal control and oversight, *and creates the
perception that there is lack of unanimity.
2. Recommendation
Implement the following procedure (or other such suitable
procedure) to redress the inadequacies of the existing system:
The best mechanism for inter-agency notification appears to be the
Community-Wide Computer-Assisted Compartmentation Control System
(4C). To effect this notification, each 4C subscriber would enter
unfavorable actions into the data base as these actions are taken
(this is now being done for the most part but not always in a
timely manner). Using a new software program to be developed for
this purpose, require that all 4C subscribers query the 4C system
daily (preferably when the system is first activated in the
morning) for any unfavorable actions entered the previous day (I
estimate that there are perhaps 5-10 such actions weekly). If any
4C subscriber agency has active interest in the subject (i.e., has
also issued its own eligibility), that agency would be obliged to
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Subj: SCI COMMUNITY POLICY ON UNFAVORABLE SCI ELIGIBILITY ACTIONS
immediately withdraw the SCI eligibility and contact the agency
that initiated the unfavorable action. (Note that DIA and NSA are
not presently subscribers to the 4C system and should be encour-
aged to join the 4C network.) If there should be disagreement
between/among agencies about an unfavorable action, those agencies
would be required to resolve the difference. If unable to do so
(I believe this would be extremely rare), the issue would be
brought before an impartial adjudicator/arbiter appointed by the
DCI Security Forum Chairman for final determination of SCI
eligibility.
3. Comment
The key provisions of the recommendation and process are:
a. An effective and timely inter-agency notification
mechanism for unfavorable actions relating to SCI eligibility.
b. Unfavorable action by any one agency would be respected
and supported by all agencies until the matter is resolved.
c An effective means for resolving an SCI eligibility
impasse.
4. Impact on the Intelligence Community
A clear message would be sent to the Intelligence Community that
the SCI community member agencies operate from a basis of
unanimity.
M. PELENSKY
Captain, U. S. Navy
Copy to:
DCI Security Forum Members
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