AL-QADHDHAFI ON EGYPT, OTHER ISSUES

• Document Type: CREST
• Collection: General CIA Records
• Document Number (FOIA) /ESDN (CREST): CIA-RDP05-01559R000400440003-4
• Release Decision: RIFPUB
• Original Classification: U
• Document Page Count: 17
• Document Creation Date: December 22, 2016
• Document Release Date: January 19, 2012
• Sequence Number: 3
• Publication Date: October 28, 1989
• Content Type: CABLE

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PAAUZYUW RUQMIFA0361 3011843 MTMS-UUUU--RUEBHAA RUEBHAA.
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P 28183OZ OCT 89
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RUCJACC/USCENTCOM MACDILL AFB FL//CCPA//
RUCQAAA/USCINCCENT INTELLIGENCE CENTER MACDILL AFB FL
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RUEBHAA/STORAGE CENTER FBIS WASHINGTON DC
RUEHEY/AMEMBASSY CAIRO
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SERIAL: JN2810183089
/***** THIS IS A COMBINED MESSAGE
BODY
COUNTRY: LIBYA
SUBJ: TAKE 1 OF 15 -- AL-QADHDHAFI ON EGYPT, OTHER ISSUES
REF: 1. JN2810163489 FYI ON AL-QADHDHAFI AL-MUSAWWAR INTERVIEW
2. NC2510160389 AND ADDS CAIRO MENA ARABIC 251500 --
AL-QADHDHAFI AL-MUSAWWAR INTERVIEW
y
SOURCE: CAIRO '1L-MUSAWWAR IN ARABIC 27 OCT 89 PP 4-12 FL
TEXT: ~4D ./
//((INTERVIEW WITH LIBYAN LEADER COLONEL MU'AMMAR AL-QADHDHAFI)BY
EDITOR-IN-CHIEF MAKRAM N,'UHAMMAD AHNAD IN BA HAZI DATE' T--'
GIVEN))
((TEXT)) AL-MUSAWWAR: YOUR EXCELLENCY THE COLONEL: WITH
RELATIONS NOW BACK TO NOVIAL, WHAT ARE THE PROSPECTS FOR EGYPTIAN-
LIBYAN TIES AFTER YOUR TALKS WITH PRESIDENT MUBARAK IN MARSA MATRUH
AND TOBRUK?
THE COLONEL: IT IS NECESSARY FOR ME TO POINT OUT, TO BEGIN WITH,
THAT THE PROBLEMS WITH EGYPT WERE ROOTED IN OUR DIFFERENCES 0.L-,R THE
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PAN-ARAB ISSUE. EGYPT HAD ITS VIEWPOINT, AND WE HAD OUR DIFFERENT
VIEWPOINT, AND SO THERE WAS A CLASH IN OUR PERCEPTIONS. THE ISSUE
WAS NOT -- AS SOME HAVE SOUGHT TO PORTRAY IT -- ONE OF DISAGREEMENT
AS TO LEADERSHIP BETWEEN ONE ARAB COUNTRY AND ANOTHER. THE
DISAGREEMENT HAD A PAN-ARAB DIMENSION BEYOND THE SCOPE OF EGYPTIAN-
LIBYAN RELATIONS. I THINK THE MEETINGS WITH PRESIDENT MUBARAK IN
CASABLANCA AND LATER IN MARSA MATRUH AND TOBRUK HAVE PRODUCED QUITE
A SUBSTANTIAL DEGREE OF UNDERSTANDING OVER THE PAN-ARAB PROBLEM,
THUS MAKING IT POSSIBLE FOR US TO PROCEED TOGETHER UNHINDERED, HAND
IN HAND, TOWARD THE FORESEEABLE FUTURE OF EGYPTIAN-LIBYAN RELATIONS
AND IN THE INTEREST OF COMMON ARAB ACTION.
AL-MUSAWWAR: YOUR EXCELLENCY THE COLONEL: THE MARSA MATRUH AND
TOBRUK SESSIONS HAVE PRODUCED AGREEMENT ON A NUMBER OF PHYSICAL,
CONCRETE MEASURES THAT DIRECTLY AFFECT THE INTERESTS OF CITIZENS IN
THE TWO COUNTRIES. PERHAPS THERE WERE NO BANNER HEADLINES; MAYBE
THE RESULTS DID NOT MEASURE UP TO YOUR EXPECTATIONS REGARDING THE
UNITY ISSUE: IN THE END, THOUGH, WE NOW HAVE PRACTICAL STEPS LAYING
DOWN SOUND FOUNDATIONS FOR THE BENEFIT OF THE TWO PEOPLES.
THE COLONEL: THAT IS CORRECT. IN THE PAST, WE HOPED THAT
AGREEMENT BETWEEN THE POLITICAL RANKS OF THE TWO COUNTRIES WAS THE
RIGHT APPROACH TO BUILDING COMMON INTERESTS. THIS HAS NOT
SUCCEEDED, HOWEVER. NOW WE ARE TRYING TO LEARN FROM THE PAST. I
THINK THE REALISTIC START WE MADE IN MARSA MATRUH AND TOBRUK HAS PUT
US ON THE RIGHT TACK, INSTEAD OF IGNORING REALITY. WE HAVE BEGUN
REMOVING THE STUMBLING BLOCKS PREVENTING THE JOINING TOGETHER OF THE
INTERESTS OF ORDINARY CITIZENS IN BOTH COUNTRIES. ONLY SUCH LINKS
CAN BUILD THE JOINT INFRASTRUCTURE ON WHICH TO BUILD POLITICAL
RELATIONS. I DO NOT FORESEE ANY UNDUE DIFFICULTY IN THE TWO
COUNTRIES COMPLEMENTING EACH OTHER IN THE FUTURE. AFTER ALL, WE ARE
ONE PEOPLE AND PART OF ONE NATION WITH SHARED INTERESTS -- NOT TO
MENTION OUR COMMON DESTINY AND FUTURE. THE BARBED WIRE ERECTED BY
THE ITALIANS ALONG OUR BORDER IS AN ARTIFICIAL BARRIER; WE ARE ONE
PEOPLE AND OURS IS ONE LAND.
I WOULD LIKE TO STRESS THAT THERE IS ABSOLUTELY NO DIFFICULTY
WITH EGYPT. ALL WE DID IN MARSA MATRUH AND TOBRUK WAS PUT THINGS
BACK IN THEIR PROPER PERSPECTIVE, SINCE, GEOGRAPHICALLY AND
DEMOGRAPHICALLY, THE TWO COUNTRIES ARE IN REALITY ONE NATION.
I DO NOT SEE ANY PROBLEM THERE -- THE MESHING OF RELATIONS
BETWEEN THE TWO PEOPLES GOES FAR BACK INTO HISTORY. BEFORE THE
ESTRANGEMENT IN RELATIONS, THE EGYPTIANS SHOWED PREFERENCE FOR LIBYA
AS A PLACE OF WORK, AND LIBYAN TRAVELLERS HEADED FOR EGYPT BOTH FOR
RECREATION AND MEDICAL TREATMENT. RELATIONS BETWEEN THE TWO PEOPLES
WERE DEEP AND EXTENSIVE. IF WE HAD BANNED ALL THIS DURING THE
RUPTURE IN RELATIONS, CERTAINLY IT WAS AN ARBITRARY BAN. IT WAS
THEREFORE IMPORTANT TO MAKE THE RIGHT START. WE HAD TO START FROM
RECOGNIZING THE RIGHT TO WORK AND THE FREEDOM OF MOVEMENT AND
RESIDENCE. WE HAD TO PROCEED BASED ON THE JOINT INTERESTS OF THE
TWO PEOPLES.
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SERIAL: JN2810190889
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REF: JN2810183089 CAIRO AL-MUSAWWAR ARABIC 27 OCT///THE TWO PAGE:0003
PEOPLES
TEXT:
((TEXT)) AL-MUSAWWAR: YOUR EXCELLENCY THE COLONEL, HOW COULD
THREE MEETINGS END AN ESTRANGEMENT THAT LASTED 16 YEARS UNLESS THERE
WAS A MUTUAL UNDERSTANDING? WHAT ARE THE LIMITS OF THE MUTUAL
UNDERSTANDING REACHED BETWEEN YOU AND PRESIDENT MUBARAK?
THE COLONEL: FIRST, I HAVE KNOWN PRESIDENT MUBARAK SINCE HE WAS
COMMANDER OF THE AIR FORCE, AND PROBABLY BEFORE THAT. HE ALSO HAS
KNOWN ME FOR A LONG TIME. I BELIEVE THAT WE BOTH HAVE GOOD
IMPRESSIONS ABOUT THE OTHER BECAUSE WE COOPERATED TOGETHER DURING A
PERIOD OF BROTHERHOOD AND SYMPATHY BEFORE THE ESTRANGEMENT.
DURING THAT PERIOD, IN THE TIME OF PRESIDENTS 'ABD-AL-NASIR AND
AL-SADAT, COOPERATION BETWEEN US WAS VERY STRONG. EGYPT COULD ASK
FOR ANYTHING FROM LIBYA AND THERE WOULD BE AN IMMEDIATE RESPONSE,
AND LIBYA COULD ASK FOR ANYTHING FROM EGYPT AND THERE WOULD BE A
QUICK RESPONSE. PRESIDENT MUBARAK PROBABLY KNOWS BEST ABOUT THE AID
THAT LIBY.'. PROVIDED FOR THE SAKE OF THE PAN-ARAB BATTLE.
WHEN PRESIDENT MUBARAK ASSUMED RESPONSIBILITY, UNDER CRITICAL
EGYPTIAN AND ARAB CIRCUMSTANCES, WE HAD A SINCERE DESIRE TO END ALL
THE PROBLEMS THAT HAD ARISEN WITH EGYPT BECAUSE OF DIFFERENCES ON
THE PAN-ARAB CAUSE. AN INDIRECT DIALOGUE TOOK PLACE BETWEEN US
THROUGH SEVERAL ENVOYS AND INTERMEDIARIES, BUT CIRCUMSTANCES DID NOT
HELP IT SUCCEED.
ON THE ONE HAND, EGYPT HAD NEW CONNECTIONS, WHICH COULD NOT BE
IGNORED. ON THE OTHER, WE WERE LOOKING UPON EGYPT AS IF NOTHING HAD
CHANGED AND AS IF THE NEW ADMINISTRATION WAS AN EXTENSION OF THE OLD
ONE. THE MISTAKE WAS THAT WE LOOKED UPON EGYPT DURING MUBARAK'S
TIME AS AN EXTENSION OF THE AL-SADAT PERIOD. THIS CONTINUED TO BE
THE CASE UNTIL MATTERS WERE CLARIFIED AND IT BECAME OBVIOUS THAT
UNDER PRESIDENT MUBARAK, EGYPT WAS GOING THROUGH A DIFFERENT PHASE.
OUR DIRECT MEETING IN CASABLANCA HAS PAVED THE WAY FOR OUR MUTUAL
UNDERSTANDING. THIS IS BECAUSE IT WAS IMPOSSIBLE, IN THE CLIMATE OF
EGYPTIAN-LIBYAN RELATIONS, TO LEARN ABOUT, OR UNDERSTAND MATTERS AS
THEY REALLY WERE THROUGH THE MEDIA, WHICH WERE THEN ENGAGED IN
MUTUAL BATTLES.
WE MET IN CASABLANCA, AND IN THAT DIRECT MEETING, I UNDERSTOOD
THE MAN'S STANDING AND POSITION. I MAY EVEN SAY THAT I VALUED THAT
POSITION HIGHLY. PRESIDENT MUBARAK BELIEVED THAT THE TIMES HAD
CHANGED AND THAT THE ISSUE WAS NO LONGER ONE OF AN ENEMY AND ARMS.
HE BELIEVED THAT AGREEMENT ON THE SUPREME OBJECTIVES DOES NOT
PREVENT US FROM USING DIFFERENT METHODS TO ACHIEVE THOSE OBJECTIVES.
HE BELIEVED THAT ARAB SOLIDARITY WAS CAPABLE OF GUARANTEEING PAN-
ARAB RIGHTS. HE ALSO BELIEVED THAT THE CURRENT PERIOD SHOULD NOT BE
ONE OF WAILING AND SHOUTING, BUT A PERIOD OF CULTURAL BUILDING,
BECAUSE WITHOUT ECONOMIC, TECHNOLOGICAL, AND CULTURAL EXCELLENCE, IT
IS DIFFICULT FOR US TO TALK ABOUT OUR ABILITY TO FACE FUTURE
CHALLENGES.
IN CASABLANCA, OUR VIEWS WERE IN AGREEMENT ON MEANS TO CONFRONT
FUTURE CHALLENGES, ON THE NATURE OF THE COMING AGE, AND ON THE
IMPORTANCE OF THE CULTURAL BATTLE IN WINNING A SECURE AND PROSPEROUS
FUTURE FOR THE ARABS. THIS IS BECAUSE PARITY BETWEEN US AND ISRAEL
CANNOT BE ACHIEVED BY INCREASING THE NUMBER OF SOLDIERS OR WEAPONS.
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BUT, IT CAN BE ACHIEVED THROUGH ECONOMIC POWER, TECHNOLOGICAL
CAPABILITY, AND CULTURAL EXCELLENCE.
PAGE:0004
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ATTN JORDAN AAMM
SERIAL: JN2810200089
COUNTRY: LIBYA
SUBJ: TAKE 3 OF 15 -- AL-QADHDHAFI ON EGYPT, OTHER ISSUES
REF: JN2810183089 CAIRO AL-MUSAWWAR ARABIC 27 OCT///AND
CULTURAL EXCELLENCE.
TEXT:
((TEXT)) ((AL-QADHDHAFI CONTINUES)) WE HAVE DISCOVERED HERE
THAT OUR INSISTENCE ON BOYCOTTING EGYPT MEANS HELPING THE ISRAELIS
TO ACHIEVE THEIR GOALS. WE HAVE DISCOVERED THAT WE SHOULD NOT ALLOW
THE ISRAELIS TO BE AN OBSTACLE TO ARAB SOLIDARITY AND UNITY, BECAUSE
BY ACCEPTING SUCH A ROLE FOR THE ISRAELIS, WE ACHIEVE THEIR GOALS
FOR THEM. THEY WERE HAPPY WHEN THEY OPENED AN EMBASSY IN EGYPT AND
CAUSED A BOYCOTT BETWEEN EGYPT AND HE ARABS. THEY ALSO CAUSED AN
ESTRANGEMENT BETWEEN THE EGYPTIAN AND LIBYAN PEOPLES, WHO ARE THE
TWO CLOSEST ARAB PEOPLES.
WE MAY DISAGREE OVER THE EXISTENCE OF THAT EMBASSY IN CAIRO, BUT
THIS IS NOT THE END OF THE ROAD. I CAN FINALLY SAY THAT OUR ARAB
WILL HAS PREVAILED THROUGH THIS MEETING, DESPITE THE EXISTENCE OF AN
ISRAELI EMBASSY IN CAIRO.
AL-MUSAWWAR: YOUR EXCELLENCY THE COLONEL, DO YOU NOT BELIEVE
THAT THE ARABS HAVE THE RIGHT TO A JUST PEACE THAT WILL FULFIL THE
PALESTINIANS' NATIONAL ASPIRATIONS AND WILL BRING STABILITY TO THE
REGION?
THE COLONEL: THE PROBELEM IS THAT THE ISRAELIS DO NOT WANT
PEACE. AT LEAST THIS IS WHAT I BELIEVE. IT IS THEY WHO COMMITTED
AGGRESSION IN 1948 AND THEY HAVE STARTED ALL THE WARS IN PALESTINE
THEY HAVE BOMBED CAIRO, DAMASCUS, BAGHDAD, TUNIS, BEIRUT, AND LIBYA,
WHILE NOT ONE OF OUR PLANES HAS RAIDED ANY OF THEIR CITIES. I
BELIEVE THEY WILL FIGHT US AGAIN AND THEY WILL NOT RESPOND TO ANY
PEACE CALLS BECAUSE WAR HAS BECOME PART OF THE ISRAELI SOCIETY.
AL-MUSAWWAR: YOUR EXCELLENCY THE COLONEL, I HAVE A DIRECT
QUESTION. WHAT DO YOU WANT FROM EGYPT, AND HOW DO YOU VIEW ITS ROLE
IN THE CURRENT CIRCUMSTANCES?
THE COLONEL: I WANT EGYPT TO MAINTAIN ITS ENTHUSIASM IN CALLING
FOR AN ARAB UNITY. I WANT EGYPT TO PLAY A LEADING ROLE AND TO
CONTINUE TO LEAD ARAB ACTION FROM THE OCEAN TO THE GULF. I DO NOT
BELIEVE THAT THIS CALL CONFLICTS WITH EGYPT'S PEACE TREATY WITH
ISRAEL. THE ISRAELIS HAVE NOTHING TO DO WITH THE ARAB NATION'S
EFFORTS TO UNIFY ITSELF AND PROTECT ITS RIGHTS EFFECTIVELY IN A
WORLD THAT HAS NO PLACE FOR SMALL ENTITIES.
AL-MUSAWWAR: YOUR EXCELLENCY THE COLONEL, THE VOICE OF ARAB
UNITY HAS FADED AWAY SLIGHTLY BECAUSE THE ARAB MASSES HAVE REACHED
THE BRINK OF DISPAIR AS A RESULT OF SEVERAL ABORTIVE UNIONIST
EXPERIENCES.
THE COLONEL: EVEN IF THE ARAB MASSES HAVE BEEN DISAPPOINTED BY
REPEATED FAILURES, CAIRO SFJULD PLAY A LEADING ROLE TO REGAIN THE
CONFIDENCE OF THE ARAB MASSES IN THE SIOGANS ((OF ARAB UNITY --
UNCLASSIFIED
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FBIS)) BECAUSE THIS AGE IS THE AGE OF LARGER ENTITIES.
?
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SERIAL: JN2810205489
REF: JN2810183089 CAIRO AL-MUSAWWAR ARABIC 27 OCT///OF LARGER
ENTITIES.
TEXT:
((TEXT)) AL-MUSAWWAR: YOUR EXCELLENCY THE COLONEL, WHAT DO YOU
HAVE TO SAY ABOUT THE GUARANTEES FOR THE CONTINUATION AND STABILITY
OF EGYPTIAN-LIBYAN RELATIONS? -- FOR ALTHOUGH WHAT HAPPENED HAS
RECEIVED AN ENTHUSIASTIC WELCOME, THERE ARE SILL FEARS THAT
SOMETHING COULD SUDDENLY CHANGE THE SHIP'S COURSE.
THE COLONEL: NO ONE HAS A CRYSTAL BALL TO PREDICT THE INTENTIONS
OF THOSE WHO SEEK TO TORPEDO THIS RAPPROCHEMENT. ONLY GOD KNOWS
THIS. I CAN SAY, HOWEVER, THAT, ON THE BASIS OF OUR INTENTIONS,
CAPABILITIES, AND THE UNDERSTANDING REACHED BETWEEN PRESIDENT
MUBARAK AND MYSELF IN CASABLANCA, MARSA MATRUH, AND TOBRUK,rWE AGREE
ON THE NEED TO WORK, AND TO PROTECT OUR WORK FROM ANY THREAT OF
COLLAPSE. I BELIEVE THAT WE HAVE HAD A RICH EXPERIENCE FROM WHICH
WE HAVE LEARNED VALUABLE LESSONS. WE HAVE TRIED ESTRANGEMENT AND
MEDIA CAMPAIGNS, AND PLANTED MINES IN BORDER AREAS. CAN WE DO MORE
THAN WHAT WE HAVE ACTUALLY DONE? I SAY THAT IT WOULD BE RIDICULOUS
AND POINTLESS TO RETURN TO INSULTS AND ESTRANGEMENT, OR TO IMPAIR
OUR CAPABILITIES.
IT WAS ABNORMAL THAT TENSION PREVAILED ON THE EGYPTIAN-LIBYAN
BORDER. IF YOU ASK AN EGYPTIAN SOLDIER STANDING BEHIND THE BARBED
WIRE ABOUT HIS TRIBE, HE WILL SAY THAT HE IS FROM THE AL-QATA'INAH
TRIBE. WHEN YOU ASK A LIBYAN SOLDIER ON THE OTHER SIDE, YOU WILL
FIND THAT HE IS FROM THE SAME TRIBE. THEY ARE BOTH FROM THE SAME
TRIPE. SO, HOW CAN A CONFRONTATION TAKE PLACE BETWEEN TWO
BRO'IAERS?
AL-MUSAWWAR: SOME OF TH.'. RESOLUTIONS ANNOUNCED IN TOBRUK, FOR
EXAMPLE THOSE ON ENTRY BY IDENTITY CARDS, THE FREEDOM OF MOVEMENT,
WORK, TOURISM, AND MEDICAL TREATMENT, COULD HAVE BEEN EXPECTED.
HOWEVER, THE AGREEMENT ON LINKING THE TWO COUNTRIES BY RAILWAY
BETWEEN AL-SALLUM AND TOBRUK WAS A SURPRISE. WHOSE IDEA WAS THIS,
AND WHAT PURPOSE DOES THE AL-SALLUM-TOBRUK RAILWAY SERVE?
COLONEL AL-QADHDHAFI: THE RAILWAY WAS ALREADY THERE, BUT IT HAS
BEEN NEGLECTED SINCE WORLD WAR II. WHEN PRESIDENT MUBARAK PROPOSED
THE RENOVATION OF THE RAILWAY, HE ADDED A NEW ARTERY TO RELATIONS
BETWEEN THE TWO COUNTRIES; OR HE LINKED THE ONE BODY WITH A NEW
ARTERY SO THAT THERE WOULD BE LAND, SEA, AND RAILWAY LINKS. THE
OBJECTIVE IS TO SERVE THE PEOPLE'S INTERESTS BOTH HERE AND THERE,
BECAUSE THERE IS NO DIFFERENCE BETWEEN A LIBYAN AND AN EGYPTIAN.
THEY ARE ONE PEOPLE. IF YOU ASK THE PEOPLE WHO LIVE IN THE AREA
AROUND TOBRUK ABOUT THEIR ORIGINS, YOU WILL FIND THAT THEY BELONG TO
THE AL-QATA'INAH, AL-DAB'AN, AND AWLAD 'ALI TRIBES -- THE TRIBES OF
MARSA MATRUH, AL-SALLUM, AND THE WESTERN SAHARA. THEY ARE ALL OF
THE SAME KIN AND BELONG TO ONE TRIBE. PERHAPS, YOU HAVE MET ENG
AHMAD HILMI, WHO WAS A MINISTER OF LIGHT INDUSTRIES IN EGYPT. HE IS
CURRENTLY OCCUPYING THE SAME POST IN LIBYA. IN LIGHT OF THIS, IT IS
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OUR DUTY TO PROMOTE RELATIONS BETWEEN THE PEOPLE BOTH HERE AND
THERE, BECAUSE IN THE END, THEY ARE ONE PEOPLE, AND LOVE EACH OTHER.
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REF: JN2810183089 CAIRO AL-MUSAWWAR ARABIC 27 OCT///LOVE EACH
OTHER
TEXT:
((TEXT)) AL-MUSAWWAR: YOUR EXCELLENCY THE COLONEL, IS IT STILL
PREMATURE TO ASK ABOUT THE CAUSES OF THE DELAY IN THE EXCHANGE OF
DIPLOMATIC REPRESENTATION BETWEEN THE TWO COUNTRIES? THE QUESTION
IS IMPORTANT BECAUSE, IN MARSAH MATRUH AND TOBRUK, YOU MADE MANY
DECISIONS WHOSE IMPLEMENTATION BETWEEN THE TWO COUNTRIES MUST BE
FOLLOWED UP.
THE COLONEL: PERHAPS YOU KNOW THAT THERE HAS BEEN NO DIPLOMATIC
REPRESENTATION BETWEEN EGYPT, LIBYA, AND SYRIA SINCE THE
ESTABLISHMENT OF THE FEDERATION OF ARAB REPUBLICS. WE HAVE NO
AMBASSADOR IN DAMASCUS, AND SYRIA HAS NO AMBASSADOR IN LIBYA. THERE
ARE REPRESENTATIVES AT LIAISON OFFICES IN THE TWO COUNTRIES.
SIMILARLY, THERE IS NO DIPLOMATIC REPRESENTATION BETWEEN LIBYA AND
TUNISIA. WE BOTH HAVE ENVOYS WHO HANDLE RELATIONS BETWEEN THE TWO
CAPITALS. I HAVE AGREED WITH PRESIDENT MUBARAK TO ESTABLISH FOLLOW-
UP BUREAUS IN EGYPT AND LIBYA WHOSE TASK WILL BE TO FOLLOW UP
IMPLEMENTATION OF THE DECISIONS AND TO PREPARE FOR MEETINGS OF THE
JOINT MINISTERIAL COMMITTEES.
AL-MUSAWWAR: WHAT WILL BE THE STRUCTURE OF THESE BUREAUS?
THE COLONEL: THEY WILL INCLUDE INDIVIDUALS WHO WILL HAVE COMPLETE
AUTHORITY TO FOLLOW UP ON ALL BILATERAL ISSUES.
AL-MUSAWWAR: YOUR EXCELLENCY THE COLONEL: YOU HAVE FOUGHT MANY
BATTLES TO ACCOMPLISH NUMEROUS UNITY PROJECTS. HOWEVER, UNITY WAS
NOT ATTAINED, PERHAPS BECAUSE THE PREVAILING STATE OF AFFAIRS WAS
MORE DIFFICULT. WHY DO YOU NOT REVIEW ALL PAST EXPERIMENTS, FOR
SUCH A REVIEW MAY INDICATE TO US THE BEGINNING OF THE CORRECT
SOLUTION?
THE COLONEL: THE TRUTH IS THAT OUR EXPERIENCE IS RICH WITH THE
LESSONS WE HAVE LEARNED. EFFORTS TO ACHIEVE ARAB UNITY HA'E NOT
BEEN IN VAIN. I CAN SEE THAT THEY HAVE NOT FAILED. THIS EXPERIENCE
HAS BROUGHT ABOUT A HUGE ASSET FOR UNITY AND HAS LEFT A RICH
HERITAGE OF UNITY, WHOSE IMPACT WE ARE NOW FEELING. ALL ARABS ARE
NOW CONVINCED OF WHAT WE HAVE BEEN CALLING FOR OVER THE PAST 20
YEARS.
HAD THE ARABS CAST OFF THEIR DOUBTS ABOUT UNITY, WE WOULD BE
LIVING NOW IN A STRONGER, MORE SECURE, AND MORE P:.LSTIGIOUS POSITION
UNDER THE BANNER OF UNITY. I BELIEVE THAT THE ARAB POSITION IS NOW
INCLINED TO ACCEPT UNITY ACTION MORE THAN AT ANY PREVIOUS TIME
BECAUSE UNITY HAS BECOME A NECESSITY AND NOT ONLY AN EMOTIONAL
DEMAND. THOSE WHO VIEWED IT IN THE PAST AS BEING AN EMOTIONAL
DEMAND NOW BELEIVE THAT IT HAS BECOME A NECESSITY OF DAILY LIFE. IN
A FEW YEARS, THE GULF COOPERATION COUNCIL (GCC) AND THE ARAB
COOPERATION COUNCIL ((ACC)) WERE ESTABLISHED, AND THE ARAB MAGHREB
UNION ((UMA)) IS NOW BEING FORMED. IN THE PAST, IT WAS DIFFICULT TO
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MAKE FOUR OR FIVE COUNTRIES WORK TOWARD THE SAME OBJECTIVE. THE
PICTURE IS DIFFERENT NOW BECAUSE ALL ARE CONVINCED THAT SEVERAL
CRUCIAL ISSUES THE ARAB NATION CURENTLY FACES CAN ONLY BE SOLVED
PROPERLY WITHIN THE FRAMEWORK OF UNIONIST ACTION.
WHO WOULD HAVE BELIEVED THAT THE ARAB LEAGUE COUNCIL WOULD
FINALLY APPROVE A LIBYAN DRAFT RESOLUTION FOR CHANGING THE ARAB
LEAGUE CHARTER TO MAKE THE ARAB SUMMIT A PRESIDIUM COMPOSED OF THE
ARAB PRIME MINISTERS; AN EXECUTIVE COUNCIL COMPOSED OF THE COMPETENT
ARAB MINISTERS; SPECIALIZED COUNCILS; A SPECIALIZED COUNCIL OF
INDUSTRY MINISTERS; AND ANOTHER COUNCIL OF AGRICULTURE MINISTERS TO
SUPPORT THE IDEA OF UNITY IN ITS ECONOMIC AND CONCRETE ASPECTS, SUCH
AS JOINT VENTURES TO BIND ARAB COUNTRIES TOGETHER ON THE BASIS OF
COMMON INTERESTS AND A SINGLE INFRASTRUCTURE?
/****** BEGINNING OF TAKE 006
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ATTN JORDAN AAMM
SERIAL: JN2910052189
REF: JN2810183089 CAIRO AL-MUSAWWAR ARABIC 27 OCT///A SINGLE
INFRASTRUCTURE?
TEXT:
((TEXT)) AL-MUSAWWAR: YOUR EXCELLENCY THE COLONEL, OUR
OBJECTIVES OF 20 YEARS AGO MAY HAVE BEEN THE RIGHT ONES. OUR
APPROACHES TO THEM, THOUGH, MAY HAVE NOT BEEN REALISTIC. WE
PERCEIVED UNITY AS A MERE POLITICAL OBJECT THAT REQUIRED NOTHING
MORE THAN THE WILL OF THIS OR THAT GOVERNMENT FOR IT TO BE ACHIEVED.
THE COLONEL: IN FACT, THE GOALS WERE CORRECT. WAYS AND MEANS
HAVE VARIED, HOWEVER. WE NOW HAVE TWO APPROACHES:
THE FIRST ARGUES THAT UNITED POLITICAL RANKS WOULD HELP CHANGE A
PAROCHIAL, INWARD LOOKING STATE INTO A UNIONIST ONE. THAT WAS HOW
WE APPROACHED OUR PAST UNITY ATTEMPTS. WE THOUGHT THAT HAVING
POLITICAL LEADERS SHOULDER THE RESPONSIBILITY FOR DECISIONS WOULD
HELP UNIONIST STEPS FORWARD. THE PROBLEM WITH THIS APPROACH IS THAT
THE FATE OF THE UNIONIST ENTITY WOULD BE SUBJECT TO RELATIONS AMONG
TOP LEADERS. DIFFERENCES AMONG LEADERS WOULD SPELL THE END OF UNITY
AND A BREAKUP OF THE UNIONIST ENTITY.
THE SECOND APPROACH IS THAT UNITY MUST START AT THE FOOT OF THE
MOUNTAIN AND ASCEND STEP BY STEP TOWARD THE SUMMIT. IT MUST BEGIN
BY LINKING CITIZENS' INTERESTS THROUGH THE INFRASTRUCTURE OF ROAD
AND ELECTRICITY NETWORKS AND THROUGH A COMPLEMENTARITY OF INDUSTRIAL
AND AGRICULTURAL PROJECTS OF THE COUNTRIES INVOUED IN THE UNITY
PLAN. THIS IS BECAUSE A NETWORK OF INTERESTS WILL SPUR THE MASSES
TO DEFEND THE UNITY AND DEEPEN ITS ROOTS. IT IS FAIR TO SAY THAT
BOTH APPROACHES HAVE THEIR PLUSES AND MINUSES. OPTING FOR EITHER OF
THEM MUST DEPEND ON POLITICAL AND SOCIAL CONDITIONS.
AL-MUSAWWAR: YOUR EXCELLENCY THE PRESIDENT: THE CALL FOR PAN-
ARABISM COINCIDES WITH THE CALL FOR EUROPEAN UNITY. THE TWO BEGAN
SIMULTANEOUSLY. WHILE EUROPE IS NOW NEARING FULL ECONOMIC UNITY AS
THE YEAR 1992 APPROACHES, WE ARABS ARE STILL STAGGERING AT THE
BEGINNING OF THE ROAD. HOW DO YOU EXPLAIN THE SUCCESS OF THE
EUROPEANS AND OUR FAILURE?
THE COLONEL: THE REASONS ARE WELL KNOWN. EUROPEAN UNITY HAS
SUCCEEDED BECAUSE THERE IS A UNIFORM EUROPEAN SOCIAL FABRIC. NO
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GREAT DISPARITIES EXIST IN THE LEVELS OF PROGRESS OF EUROPEAN
COUNTRIES. ALL OF THEM SHARE ONE SOCIAL SYSTEM. DESPITE THE FACT
THAT THE EUROPEANS HAIL FROM DIFFERENT ETHNIC ORIGINS, NUMEROUS
FACTORS HAVE HELPED CREATE CONDITIONS FAVORABLE TO UNITY. AS FOR
US, IN SPITE OF OUR COMMON DESTINY AND LANGUAGE, AND OUR COMMON
ETHNIC ORIGIN, WE ARE STILL HAMSTRUNG BY NUMEROUS CONTRADICTIONS,
INCLUDING SOCIAL DISPARITIES. WE ARE ALSO HELD BACK BY DIVERGENT
POLITICAL SYSTEMS. SOME ARABS WERE APPREHENSIVE ABOUT THE
LIBERATION OF PALESTINE OUT OF FEAR THAT A LIBERATED PALESTINE WOULD
ADOPT A SOCIALIST LINEI
SOME ARABS BELIEVED THAT THEY HAD STRONGER AFFINITY FOR A WESTERN
CAPITALIST COUNTRY THAN FOR A SISTERLY ARAB STATE OF A DIFFERENT
POLITICAL PHILOSOPHY. SOME ARABS BELIEVED ANY SOCIALIST COUNTRY WAS
CLOSER TO THEM THAN ANY SISTERLY ARAB STATE. NONETHELESS, NO ONE
CAN IGNORE THE FACT THAT THE EUROPEANS HAVE DONE THE RIGHT THING BY
FOCUSSING ON THEIR JOINT INTERESTS AND GRADUATING FROM ECONOMICS TO
POLITICS, AND BY STARTING AT THE BOTTOM OF THE LADDER TO REACH THE
TOP.
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TEXT:
((TEXT)) AL-MUSAWWAR: YOUR EXCELLENCY THE COLONEL, THERE ARE
NOW THREE NEW REGIONAL ENTITIES ON THE ARAB ARENA -- THE GCC, THE
ACC, AND THE UMA. DO YOU BELIE- THESE NEW REGIONAL ENTITIES WILL
HELP ESTABLISH ARAB UNITY? DO YOU THINK THAT THESE ENTITIES HAVE
CHOSEN A MORE REALI-c:IC AND PRACTICAL COURSE BY COACENTRATING ON THE
NEED TO ESTABLISH A SOUND BASE, BEGINNING WITH COORDINATION AND
LEADING TO INTEGRATION AND UNITY?
THE COLONEL: IF THESE ENTITIES SUCCEED IN CARRYING OUT THEIR
DECLARED PROGRAMS, PARTICULARLY IN ECONOMIC COOPERATION, THEN THEY
WILL HAVE TAKEN AN IMPORTANT STEP IN THE ARABS' MARCH TOWARD UNITY.
THEY WILL CERTAINLY MOVE THE ARAB SITUATION TO A BETTER POSITION
BECAUSE UNDERSTANDING AMONG THREE OR FOUR ARAB ENTITIES IS FAR
BETTER THAN UNDERSTANDING AMONG 21 STATES.
IN ANY CASE, WHAT IS IMPORTANT IS THAT UNITY IS THE ULTIMATE GOAL
FOR THESE NEW ENTITIES. THIS IS BECAUSE, WITHOUT JOINT COORDINATION
AMONG THESE ENTITIES, DIVISION AND SECESSION MAY BECOME ESTABLISHED
FEATURES OF OUR ARAB WORLD.
WE BELIEVE THAT THE LIBYAN PLAN, WHICH THE CASABLANCA SUMMIT
CONFERENCE AGREED TO INCLUDE IN THE AMENDMENTS TO THE ARAB LEAGUE'S
CHARTER, WILL PROVIDE THE ARAB LEPGUE WITH AN OPPORTUNITY TO ALLOW
IT TO BECOME AN UMBRELLA UNDER WHICH ALL OF THESE REGIONAL ENTITIES
CAN EXIST.
AL-MUSAWWAR: YOUR EXCELLENCY THE COLONEL, ARE YOU REFERRING TO
THE PLAN TO TRANSFORM THE SUMMIT CONFERENCE INTO A PRESIDIUM WITH
AN EXECUTIVE BOARD COMPOSED OF ARAB HEADS OF G:(VERNMENT AND
SPECIALIZED COMMITTEES COMPOSED OF THE APPROPRIATE MINISTERS?
THE COLONEL: YES. A STUDY TO COMBINE THE CLAUSES OF THIS PLAN
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WITH THE AMENDMENTS TO THE ((ARAB LEAGUE -- FBIS)) CHARTER ACTUALLY
BEGAN DURING THE MEETING OF THE ARAB LEAGUE'S EXPERTS. THIS WILL BE
FOLLOWED BY A STUDY OF THE PLAN IN THE ARAB LEAGUE'S COUNCIL SO THAT
THE FINAL DRAFT CAN BE MADE AND PRESENTED TO THE NEXT SUMMIT
CONFERENCE.
AL-MUSAWWAR: YOUR EXCELLENCY THE COLONEL, IF I UNDERSTAND THIS
CORRECTLY, YOU BELIEVE THESE NEW REGIONAL ENTITIES WILL MOVE THE
ARAB SITUATION TO A BETTER POSITION THAN THE CURRENT FRAGMENTATION.
THE COLONEL: YES, AND I SUPPORT AND BACK THESE NEW ENTITIES.
AL-MUSAWWAR: ON THIS BASIS, WHAT WAS THE LIMIT OF THE MUTUAL
UNDERSTANDING REACHED BETWEEN YOU AND PRESIDENT MUBARAK ON THE
ISSUES OF ARAB UNITY AND SOLIDARITY?
THE COLONEL: WE BOTH AGREE ON THE NEED FOR JOINT COORDINATION,
LINKING THE MASSES' ECONOMIC INTERESTS, AND BUILDING A SOUND
INFRASTRUCTURE; BECAUSE THIS IS THE GUARANTEE FOR PROGRESS TOWARD
ANY SOUND UNIONIST RELATIONS.
AS I SAID EARLIER, WE MUST BEGIN WITH THE PEOPLE'S DAILY AND
VITAL INTERESTS. THE RESOLUTIONS WE ANNOUNCED IN TOBRUK SHOW OUR
CLEAR VIEW AND DETERMINATION TO BUILD A SOUND BASE FOR OUR MUTUAL
RELATIONS. WHEN THE MASSES' INTERESTS ARE INTERCONNECTED AND THE
ARTERIES ARE RUNNING IN THE SAME BODY, IT WILL BE IMPOSSIBLE FOR ANY
INDIVIDUAL TO RISK SEVERING THESE RELATIONS BECAUSE HE WOULD BE
ACTING AGAINST THE PEOPLE'S INTERESTS.
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'INTERESTS.
TEXT:
((TEXT)) ((AL-QADHDHAFI CONTINUES)) WE HAVE A CLEAR EXAiiPLE IN
THE LIBYAN-TUNISIAN RELATIONS. IN THE PAST, RULERS AND PRESIDENTS
WERE ABLE TO MEET ON BORDER AREAS. THEY COULD AGREE OR DIFFER ON
SOMETHING, BUT THEIR AGREEMENT OR DIFFERENCES COULD AFFECT THE
INTERESTS OF THE PEOPLES IN THE TWO COUNTRIES. HOWEVER, THE
SITUATION IS DIFFERENT NOW, BECAUSE THERE ARE JOINT INTERESTS
BETWEEN THE LIBYANS AND TUNISIANS. INTERESTS WERE PROMOTED THROUGH
THE TWO COUNTRIES' AGREEMENT ON THE FREEDOM OF MOVEMENT AND WORK,
AND ON EXEMPTING NATIONAL PRODUCTS FROM CUSTOMS FEES. THESE JOINT
INTERESTS CONSTITUTE THE TRUE GUARANTEE AGAINST ANY ATTEMPTS TO
SEVER DEEP RELATIONS BETWEEN THE TWO PEOPLES. WHAT APPLIES TO EGYPT
AND LIBYA, OR LIBYA AND TUNISIA, APPLIES TO INTER-ARAB RELATIONS
THROUGHOUT THE ARAB HOMELAND. THEREFORE, IT IS NECESSARY TO
CONCENTRATE ON ESTABLISHING A STRONG BASE OF JOINT AND CLOSELY-
CONNECTED INTERESTS.
WHAT IS THE USE OF A CAR FACTORY IN TACH OF EGYPT, ALGERIA, IRAQ,
AND A FOURTH ONE IN ANOTHER COUNTRY? THE FOUR FACTORIES WILL NOT
HAVE THE SAME HIGH EFFICIENCY THAT WOULD ENABLE THEM TO COMPETE
BECAUSE NONE OF THE FOUR COUNTRIES HAS A MARKET THAT ALLOWS FOR A
SUCCESSFUL INDUSTRY. HOWEVER, THE SITUATION WOULD BE DIFFERENT IF
EGYPT CHOOSES TO MANUFACTURE THE ENGINE, IRAQ CHOOSES TO MANUFACTURE
THE CHASSIS, AND ANOTHER STATE CHOOSES TO MANUFACTURE THE PULLING
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EQUIPMENT. HERE, THERE WOULD BE AN INTEGRATION OF ARAB INTERESTS IN
A MANNER THAT WOULD ALLOW THE ARAB NATION TO COMPETE WITH OTHER CAR
INDUSTRIES. IN SHORT, UNITY MUST HAVE A SOUND ECONOMIC BASIS THAT
LINKS ARAB INTERESTS. THIS IS BECAUSE UNITY WILL CONTINUE TO BE A
MERE POLITICAL SLOGAN IF IT DOES NOT MEAN AN ECONOMIC STRENGTH AND
CLOSELY-CONNECTED INTERESTS, AND THE SAFEGUARDING OF NATIONAL AND
PAN-ARAB DIGNITY.
AL-MUSAWWAR: YOUR EXCELLENCY, SINCE YOU ARE A MEMBER OF THE ARAB
MAGHREB UNION ((AMU)), WHAT IS THE VOLUME OF ACHIEVEMENTS THAT HAVE
BEEN MADE WITHIN THE FRAMEWORK OF THIS REGIONAL ENTITY THAT INCLUDES
LIBYA, TUNISIA, ALGERIA, AND MOROCCO? IS THE SAHARA PROBLEM STILL
AN OBSTACLE TO THE ESTABLISHMENT OF THIS UNION?
THE COLONEL: THE SAHARA PROBLEM COULD HAVE BEEN AN OBSTACLE TO
THE ESTABLISHMENT OF THE AMU. HOWEVER, WE NAVE IGNORED THIS
PROBLEM, OR, TO BE MORE ACCURATE, WE HAVE PUT IT ASIDE FOR THE SAKE
OF A GREATER OBJECTIVE, AND WE WENT TO MOROCCO TO WORK FOR THE
ESTABLISHMENT OF THIS UNION. FRANKLY, I SAY THAT THE PROBLEM IS
STILL UNRESOLVED. THERE ARE FEARS THAT IGNORING THE PROBLEM MIGHT
TORPEDO THE UNION, BUT WE ARE TRYING TO PREVENT THIS.
AL-MUSAWWAR: WHY IS THERE NO ARAB AGREEMENT AND CONSENSUS THAT
ARAB PROBLEMS SHOULD BE RESOLVED WITHIN THE FRAMEWORK OF
NEGOTIATIONS OR ARBITRATION INSTEAD OF CONFRONTATION AND WAR?
THE COLONEL: IT IS A VERY GRAVE MISTAKE THAT AN ARAB FIGHTS
AGAINST ANOTHER ARAB REGARDLESS OF THE REASONS BEHIND THIS WAR. I
BELIEVE THAT A SOLUTION TO THE SAHARA PROBLEM CAN ONLY BE ACHIEVED
THROUGH NEGOTIATIONS.
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THROUGH NEGOTIATIONS.
TEXT:
((TEXT)) AL-MUSAWWAR: WHY HAS LIBYA NOT EXERTED ANY EFFORTS IN
THIS RESPECT, PARTICULARLY THAT IT WAS A PARTY IN CREATING THIS
PROBLEM WHEN IT ARMED THE POPULAR FRONT FOR THE LIBERATION OF SAQUIA
EL HAMRA AND RIO DE ORO ((POLISARIO -- FBIS))?
THE COLONEL: WE EXERTED A HUGE EFFORT TO CONVINCE THE TWO
PARTIES TO AGREE TO NEGOTIATIONS AND TO SIT TOGETHER TO SEEK A
PEACEFUL SETTLEMENT FOR THE PROBLEM. MOROCCO'S ANNOUNCEMENT OF ITS
ACCEPTANCE OF THIS DIRECT DIALOGUE WITH POLISARIO WAS THE RESULT OF
THIS LIBYAN EFFORT.
WE DO NOT DENY THAT WE HELPED THE POLISARIO. WE WERE THE ONES
WHO TRAINED AND ARMED THEM TO HAVE THEM CONFRONT THE SPANISH
OCCUPATION OF THE SAHARA. WHEN THE SPANISH WITHDREW AND THE
MOROCCAN ARMY REPLACED IT, THE CONFLICT BECAME A WAR BETWEEN MOROCCO
AND THE POLISARIO. WE ALSO DO NOT DENY THAT WE CONTINUED TO SUPPORT
THE POLISARIO DURING THAT PERIOD UNTIL THE POLISARIO FORCES REACHED
15,000 MEN WHO WERE TRAINED FOR DESERT AND GUERRILLA WARFARE.
HOWEVER, WE REASSESSED OUR STAND AND SUSPENDED THE WEAPONS SUPPLIES,
AND ASKED THE POLISARIO TO TURN TO NEGOTIATIONS.
AL-MUSAWWAR: WHY THIS SUDDEN CHANGE OF STAND?
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THE COLONEL: THE WAR BECAME A PROTRACTED ONE AND EXHAUSTED BOTH
SIDES WITHOUT EITHER OF THEM SUCCEEDING IN SETTLING THE SITUATION ON
THE BATTLEFIELD. FOR THIS REASON, WE DEEMED IT NECESSARY TO END
THE SHEDDING OF ARAB BLOOD. THIS WAS IN ADDITION TO THE FACT THAT
MOROCCO HAD ACCEPTED THE IDEA OF A PLEBISCITE. NOW ALL THE EFFORTS
FOCUS ON HOLDING THIS PLEBISCITE.
AL-MUSAWWAR: YOU ARE CALLING FOR ARAB UNITY AS THERE WILL BE NO
FUTURE FOR SMALL ENTITIES. BUT AT THE SAME TIME, YOU HELP THE
POLISARIO TO ESTABLISH A NEW SMALL ENTITY?
THE COLONEL: IN PRINCIPLE, I AM AGAINST THE ESTABLISHMENT OF
THESE SMALL ENTITIES. BUT THE INCORPORATION OF THE SAHARA PEOPLE
INTO THE STATE OF MOROCCO SHOULD TAKE PLACE THROUGH NEGOTIATIONS AND
AGREEMENT, WITHOUT ANY COERCION ON THE SAHARA PEOPLE.
AL-MUSAWWAR: YOUR EXCELLENCY THE COLONEL, IF I ASK YOU ABOUT
LIBYA'S RELATIONS WITH ITS NEIGHBORS SUCH AS SUDAN, CHAD, AND
TUNISIA WILL WE BE ABLE TO SAY THAT A NEW ATMOPSHERE OF
RECONCILIATION PREVAILS OVER LIBYA'S RELATIONS WITH THESE NEIGHBOR
COUNTRIES?
THE COLONEL: THERE IS NO DOUBT THAT A NEW ATMOPSHERE OF GENERAL
RECONCILIATION PREVAILS OVER LIBYA'S RELATIONS WITH ALL OF ITS
NEIGHBORS. OUR RELATIONS WITH TUNISIA ARE EXCELLENT. WE ARE BOUND
TOGETHER BY A UNIONIST PROGRAM WHICH WE ARE IMPLEMENTING WITHOUT
UNDUE HASTE AND WITH SINCERITY THROUGH THE ESTABLISHMENT OF JOINT
INSTITUTIONS SEEKING THE TWO COUNTRIES' UNITY.
AL-MUSAWWAR: THERE IS NO LONGER ANY DISPUTE OVER THE PROBLEM OF
BORDERS IN THE CONTINENTAL SHELF, OR ANY PROBLEMS RESULTING FROM THE
EXPLOITATION OF THE OIL WELLS IN THESE AREAS WHICH WERE THE SUBJECT
OF RIVAL CLAIMS?
THE COLONEL: THERE ARE NO LONGER ANY PROBLEMS. ALTHOUGH THE
INTERNATIONAL'COURT OF JUSTICE HAD ACKNOWLEDGED LIBYA'S RIGHT TO THE
OIL WELL YOU HAVE MENTIONED, WE AGREED WITH TUNISIA THAT REVENUES
FROM THIS WELL WILL BE INVESTED IN JOINT VENTURES WHICH LINK THE TWO
PEOPLE'S INTERESTS. I AND BROTHER ZINE EL ABIDINE BEN ALI LEFT FOR
THE AREA AND INAUGURATED THIS OIL WELL, AND ANNOUNCED TO THE TWO
PEOPLE OUR DETERMINATION TO JOINTLY INVEST ITS REVENUES. HERE WE
MUST SAY THAT WHAT HAS BEEN ATTAINED IN THE FIELD OF LIBYAN-
TUNISIAN RELATIONS WOULD NOT HAVE TAKEN PLACE HAD NOT THE 7 NOVEMBER
MOVEMENT TAKEN PLACE, A MOVEMENT WHICH CHANGED THE RULE IN TUNISIA.
THIS IS SO BECAUSE MUCH OF WHAT WE HAVE ATTAINED IS THANKS TO THE
EFFORTS OF TUNISIAN PRESIDENT ZIA1E EL ABIDINE BEN ALI.
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ALI.
CAIRO AL-MUSAWWAR ARABIC 27 OCT///ABIDINE BEN
TEXT:
((TEXT)) AL-MUSAWWAR: WHAT DO YOU TH K ABOUT THE TUNISIAN
PRESIDENT?
THE COLONEL: BROTHER ZINE EL ABIDINE IS AN EXCELLENT STATESMAN.
HE IS ONE OF THOSE WHO BELIEVE IN THE SINCERITY OF THE EGYPTIAN
COURSE UNDER BROTHER PRESIDENT HUSNI MUBARAK AND THE TWO ARE BOUND
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BY EXCELLENT TIES OF BROTHERHOOD. PRESIDENT ZINE EL ABIDINE IS A
DIRECT MAN WHO DOES NOT HAVE ANY MALICIOUSNESS OR CROOKEDNESS AND HE
IS HONEST AND HAS A CLEAN SLATE. HE LOVES THE ARABS AND WORKS FOR
THE SAKE OF UNITY. HE ALSO REJECTS HEGEMONY AND ASSERTS THE
INDEPENDENCE OF TUNISIAN DECISIONMAKING.
I WANT TO ADD THAT WHAT I LIKE ABOUT A NUMBER OF ARAB PRESIDENTS
NOW IS THAT THEY DIVERT THEIR ATTENTION TO THE PROBLEMS OF THE
ORDINARY CITIZEN. THEY GO TO THE MASSES IN THEIR POSITIONS, GET
FIRSTHAND ACQUAINTANCE WITH THEIR CONDITIONS, AND ASK ABOUT THEIR
PROBLEMS. LIKE PRESIDENT HUSNI MUBARAK, WHO OVERWORKS HIMSELF BY
MEETING THE PEOPLE OF HIS HOMELAND IN THEIR DIFFERENT POSITIONS AND
ASKS ABOUT THEIR CONDITIONS, PRESIDENT ZINE EL ABIDINE BEN ALI DOES
THE SAME AND SO DO A NUMBER OF ARAB PRESIDENTS. THIS DID NOT EXIST
BEFORE. THIS IS THE REAL REVOLUTION.
AL-MUSAWWAR: YOUR EXCELLENCY THE COLONEL, I WISH TO ASK YOU
ABOUT LIBYA'S RELATIONS WITH CHAD AFTER THE RECENT CONCILIATION?
THE COLONEL: RELATIONS WITH CHAD ARE GOOD. IN OUR RECENT
MEETING, WE RESOLVED ALL THE DISPUTED PROBLEMS AND THERE ARE NO
LONGER ANY PROBLEMS BETWEEN LIBYA AND CHAD. HOWEVER, THE PROBLEM IN
CHAD IS THAT THERE IS STILL FEAR ABOUT THE POSSIBILITIES OF A
RENEWAL OF THE CONFLICT THERE, PARTICULARLL ON THE BORDERS WITH
SUDAN IN THE EAST WHERE THE FIGHTING RESUMED AMONG THE WARRING
CHADIAN GROUPS, AND SPECIALLY SINCE SOME C-[ADIAN TROOPS LEFT
NDJAMENA TO THE EAST TO TAKE PART IN THE FIGHTING WHICH IS TAKING
PLACE THERE.
CHAD'S PROBLEM LIES IN THE FACT THAT IT FAILED TO MELT ALL THESE
DIFFERENT RACES, ETHNIC GROUPS, AND RELIGIONS IN THE POT OF THE
SINGLE HOMELAND. WE ON OUR PART ARE DOING THE BEST WE CAN TO
ACHIEVE A CONCILIATION AMONG ALL THE WARRING GROUPS THERE.
AL-MUSAWWAR: CAN THIS NOT LEAD TO LIBYA BECOMING INVOLVED ONCE
AGAIN IN THE INTERNAL CONFLICT?
THE COLONEL: LIBYA WILL NEVER BE A PARTY TO ANY INTERNAL
CONFLICT CONCERNING CHAD. OUR ONLY ROLE WILL BE TO HELP -- AS MUCH
AS WE CAN AND AS MUCH AS CIRCUMSTANCES WOULD ALLOW -- RECONCILE THE
WARRING CHADIAN FACTIONS. BUT, WE WILL NOT SIDE WITH ANY PARTY.
AL-MUSAWWAR: WHAT REMAINS IS FOR US TO ASK ABOUT THE NATURE OF
CURRENT RELATIONS BETWEEN SUDAN AND LIBYA?
THE COLONEL: THOSE WHO NOW RULE IN SUDAN ARE A NATIONALISTIC
GROUP AND NO ONE CAN DOUBT THEIR LOYALTY OR INTENTIONS. THEY LOVE
THEIR HOMELAND AND THEY STRIVE TO CORRECT ITS CONDITIONS. WHEN
BROTHER 'UMAR AL-BASHIR AND A NUMBER OF HIS COMRADES VISITED ME, MY
FIRST QUESTION WAS: WHAT TEMPTED YOU TO TAKE POWER IN A COUNTRY
WHICH HAS SUCH GRAVE PROBLEMS? IN THEIR ANSWER, I FELT THE DEPTH OF
THEIR NATIONAL MOTIVE WHICH PROMPTED THEM TO MOVE IN AN ATTEMPT TO
SAVE THE SITUATION IN SUDAN.
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(TEXT)) ((AL-QADHDHAFI CONTINUES)) WE HAVE EXTENDED EVERY
POSSIBLE SUPPORT TO THE NEW REGIME BECAUSE WE FEEL ITS INTEGRITY.
IT SEEMS THAT ONE OF THE PROBLEMS OF THE SUDANESE LEADERS IS THAT
THEY HAVE NOT YET ADOPTED A CLEAR-CUT PROGRAM TO CONFRONT THE GREAT
CHALLENGES FACING THEM. THERE SHOULD BE A NATIONAL PROGRAM TO PUT
AN END TO THIS VICIOUS CIRCLE REPRESENTED IN THE MOVEMENT OF POWER
BETWEEN THE MILITARY AND THE PARTIES. IT IS A CAT-AND-MOUSE GAME.
THERE SHOULD BE A SOLUTION TO THIS POWER STRUGGLE BETWEEN THE ARMY
AND THE PARTIES, BECAUSE THIS CONFLICT HAS ENCOURAGED ETHNIC AND
SECTARIAN DISPUTE AS WELL AS SEPARATIST MOVEMENTS. THESE NEGATIVE
PHENOMENA APPEAR ONLY DURING THE INTERNAL POWER STRUGGLE.
IF THE BROTHERS IN SUDAN HAD REACHED A QUICK SOLUTION TO THIS
PROBLEM, THEY WOULD HAVE MADE A HISTORIC ACHIEVEMENT FOR SUDAN. THE
SECOND PROBLEM IS THAT SOME OF SUDAN'S AFRICAN NEIGHBORS BELIEVE
THAT RECONSIDERING SUDAN'S ARAB IDENTITY IS A SOUND BEGINNING TO
SOLVE THE PROBLEM OF REBELLION IN THE SOUTH. GARANG STRESSES.THIS
DEMAND AS A PRECONDITION FOR THE UNITY OF THE HOMELAND AND THE
RETURN OF PEACE TO '"HE SOUTH. I BELIEVE THAT CHANGING SUDAN'S ARAB
IDENTITY IS A SERIOUS DEMAND THAT SHOULD BE REJECTED BECAUSE
RELINQUISHMENT OF SUDAN'S ARAB IDENTITY MEANS THE POSSIBILITY OF
CHANGING THE IDENTITY OF ANY ARAB COUNTRY, WHERE DIFFERENT RACES AND
SECTS LIVE. WE HAVE A SIMILAR SITUATION IN IRAQ, WHERE KURDS LIVE.
WE ALSO HAVE THE SAME SITUATION IN ALGERIA AND MOROCCO. IS SUCH A
SITUATION ENOUGH FOR CHANGING THE IDENTITY OF THESE COUNTRIES?
AL-MUSAWWAR: YOUR EXCELLENCY THE COLONEL, IN ALL TRUTH, THE
SOUTH WAS RELATIVELY NEGLECTED AND ITS SHARE OF PROJECTS, SERVICES,
AND REPRESENTATION IN THE GOVERNMENT WAS RELATIVELY SMALL?
THE COLONEL: THAT IS TRUE. I VISITED THE SOUTH AND SAW THE BAD
CONDITIONS THERE. BUT THIS IS NOT THE FAULT OF THE SUDANESE PEOPLE,
BUT THE FAULT OF THE BRITISH OCCUPATION AND THE REACTIONARY
GOVERNMENTS, WHICH ENTRENCHED THESE CONDITIONS BOTH IN SOUTHERN AND
NORTHERN SUDAN.
AL-MUSAWWAR: TO WHAT EXTENT IS THERE EGYPTIAN-LIBYAN
COORDINATION ON THE SITUATION IN SUDAN?
THE COLONEL: WE AND EGYPT AGREE THAT THE PRESENT LEADERS IN
KHARTOUM. ARE NATIONALISTS AND DESERVE EVERY POSSIBLE SUPPORT. WHEN
LIEUTENANT GENERAL 'UMAR AL-BASHIR AND HIS COMRADES SEIZED POWER IN
SUDAN, WE WERE DOUBTFUL THAT THE GROUP SEIZED POWER TO PAVE THE WAY
FOR JA'FAR NUMAYRI'S RETURN TO POWER. WHEN WE CONTACTED PRESIDENT
MUBARAK ON THIS ISSUE, HE CLEARLY SAID THAT EGYPT WOULD NEVER IMPOSE
A RULER ON SUDAN WHO IS REJECTED BY THE SUDANESE PEOPLE AND THAT
EGYPT WANTS THE SUDANESE LEADERS TO TAKE THE INTERESTS OF THE
SUDANESE HOMELAND INTO CONSIDERATION. THIS POSITION HAS INCREASED
CONFIDENCE BETWEEN LIBYA AND EGYPT BECAUSE MUBARAK WAS TRUTHFUL IN
EVERYTHING HE SAID.
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HE SAID.
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((TEXT)) AL-MUSAWWAR: YOUR EXCELLENCY THE COLONEL. I HOPE YOU
WON'T MIND MY NEXT QUESTION: WHAT IS THE DIFFERENCE BETWEEN
TERRORISM AND REVOLUTION?
THE COLONEL (LAUGHING): ON THE CONTRARY, I VERY MUCH LIKE TO
ANSWER YOUR QUESTION. REVOLUTION MIGHT USE VIOLENCE THAT BEGETS
TERROR AS A POLITICAL EXPEDIENCY AT ONE STAGE. THE FRENCH
REVOLUTION HAD RECOURSE TO SUCH TACTICS AS HAD THE BOLSHEVIKS,
GEORGE WASHINGTON, AND GARIBALDI IN ITALY. IT IS MUCH LIKE QUICK
AND URGENT SURGERY UNTIL SOCIETY SETTLES DOWN ON THE NEW BASES
ADOPTED BY THE REVOLUTION. THE GREATEST RISK, THOUGH, LIES IN THE
REVOLUTION NEEDLESSLY PURSUING VIOLENCE, WHEREBY IT MAY DEGENERATE
INTO GANGS USING TERROR FOR ITS OWN SAKE.
THE REVOLUTIONARY VIOLENCE HAS NEVER BEEN AT THE HEART OF THE
PROBLEM, SINCE OUR ARAB REVOLUTIONS HAVE RESORTED TO MINIMAL
VIOLENCE TO ATTAIN THEIR GOALS. THE PROBLEM LIES WITH THOSE WHO
SEEK TO EXPAND THE CONCEPT OF TERROR TO ENCOMPASS THE STRUGGLE OF
NATIONAL LIBERATION MOVEMENTS, AND THE SACRED POPULAR STRUGGLE FOR
FREEDOM. THE REVOLUTION AGAINST RACISM IN SOUTH AFRICA IS TERMED BY
SOME AS TERROR AS IS THE REVOLUTION IN THE OCCUPIED ARAB LAND, LATIN
AMERICA AND THE MARTINIQUE ISLANDS. I SEE THIS CLASSIFICATION AS
TERROR, PURE AND SIMPLE, SINCE THE AIM IS TO STRIKE TERROR IN THE
HEARTS OF PEOPLE SO THAT THEY REFRAIN FROM EXCERCIZING THEIR RIGHT
TO NATIONAL LIBERATION. AND WHAT DO YOU CALL THE FREEWHEELING OF
THE FLEETS OF MAJOR POWERS IN THE MEDITERRANEAN AND THE GULF? WHAT
DO YOU CALL THE BOMBING AND STRAFING OF ARAB CITIES TO TERRORIZE THE
PEOPLE AND THEIR GOVERNMENTS? WHAT DO YOU CALL ISRAEL'S ACTIONS IN
SOUTHERN LEBANON? IS THERE ANY TERROR TO MATCH THE SABRA AND
SHATILA MASSACRES?
AL-MUSAWWAR: YOUR EXCELLENCY THE COLONEL. IF YOU WILL EXCUSE MY
BLUNT QUESTION, LIBYA MAY HAVE DONE A DISSERVICE TO ITSELF WHEN IT
EMBRACED SOME GROUPS THAT USED TERROR IN THE NAME OF REVOLUTIONARY
VIOLENCE.
THE COLONEL: AT ONE TIME, WE DID SUPPORT SOME OF THESE GROUPS
WITHOUT CHECKING OUT THEIR AIMS AND ROLES. BUT, HAVING FOUND THAT
THEY DO MORE HARM THAN GOOD TO THE ARAB CAUSE EVEN IN TERMS OF WORLD
PUBLIC OPINION, WE HALTED OUR SUPPORT. WE HAD MISTAKENLY IMAGINED
THAT THESE GROUPS CAN BE PART OF THE NATIONAL LIBERATION MOVEMENT.
WE FOUND THAT THEY ARE USING TERROR FOR ITS OWN SAKE AND ON BEHALF
OF OTHER AIMS UNRELATED TO THE PAN-ARAB CAUSE.
TO BE HONEST, I AM SAYING THAT PLANE HIJACKING AND MURDER OF
CIVILIANS ARE CRIMINAL ACTS THAT HAVE NOTHING TO DO WITH FIGHTING.
WE OUGHT NOT TO BE HELD TO ACCOUNT SINCE WE HAVE WITHHELD OUR
SUPPORT FOR THESE GROUPS.
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ATTN JORDAN AAMM
SERIAL: JN2910095489
REF: JN2810183089 CAIRO AL-MUSAWWAR ARABIC 27 OCT///FOR THESE
GROUPS.
TEXT:
((TEXT)) AL-MUSAWWAR: YOUR EXCELLENCY THE COLONEL, WHEN WILL THE
REVOLUTION SETTLE DOWN TO BECOME AN ESTABLISHED LAW-BASED SYSTEM
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THAT OBSERVES LAWS AND RESPECTE THE INDIVIDUAL FREEDOM IN SOCIETY?
THE COLONEL: IF YOU MEAN THE LIBYAN REVOLUTION, THE REVOLUTION
HAS LAID DOWN A POPULAR SYSTEM THAT GIVES THE PEOPLE FULL POWER
THROUGH POPULAR CONGRESSES GROUPING THE MASSES IN THE URBAN AND
RURAL CENTERS. THERE ARE NO SPECIAL TRIBUNALS OR EMERGENCY LAWS IN
OPERATION NOW. IF AT ONE STAGE WE HAD RECOURSE TO SUCH MEANS, IT IS
NOW A THING OF THE PAST AND THE POPULAR CONGRESSS ARE NOW INVESTED
WITH REAL POWER.
AL-MUSAWWAR: YOUR EXCELLENCY THE COLONEL, UNTIL QUITE RECENTLY
YOU WERE IN PURSUIT OF LIBYAN OPPOSITION AROUND THE WORLD.
THE COLONEL: WHICH OPPOSITION? THESE WERE OPPOSED TO THE
PEOPLE'S POWER REPRESENTED IN THE POPULAR CONGRESSES. SOME TIME AGO
WE OFFERED A SAFE RETURN TO WHOEVER WANTED TO DO SO. WE DO NOT
PROHIBIT ANYONE, EVEN FROM THE OPPOSITION, TO EXPRESS HIS VIEWPOINT
AT THE POPULAR CONGRESSES. AFTER ALL, THE FINAL SAY BELONGS TO THE
MAJORITY VOTE IN THESE CONGRESSES. INDEED ALL OPPONENTS HAVE
RETURNED HOME WITH THE EXCEPTION OF THOSE WHO HAVE TIED THEIR FATE
TO FOREIGN QUARTERS.
AL-MUSAWWAR: YOUR EXCELLENCY THE COLONEL, THERE IS THE QUESTION
OF AMBITION JUXTAPOSED AGAINST ABILITIES. DO YOU SEE YOURSELF IN
FULL CONFRONTATION WITH THE UNITED STATES. WHY DON'T YOU GO FOR
DIALGUE IN PREFERENCE TO CONFRONTATION?
THE COLONEL: WE HAVE NO OBJECTION TO SITTING AND TALKING WITH
THE UNITED STATES ANYPLACE THEY LIKE. WE HAVE NO PRECONDITIONS.
LET ME STATE CLEARLY THAT WE DO NOT BELIEVE IN THE INEVITABILITY OF
CONFRONTATION WITH THE UNITED STATES. INDEED, WE BELIEVE THAT A
GOOD MANY OF THE PROBLEMS BETWEEN US ARE CAPABLE OF BEING RESOLVED
AT THE CONFERENCE TABLE. WE ARE IN FAVOR OF RELATIONS BASED ON
RECIPROCAL RESPECT AND COMMON INTERESTS. WE DO NOT FEEL ANY HATRED
TOWARD THE AMERICAN PEOPLE. WE ALSO THINK THE AMERICAN PEOPLE HAVE
NO HARD FEELINGS TOWARD US. THINGS WERE COMPLICATED DURING THE
REAGAN ADMINISTRATION WHEN THE WHOLE WORLD SCENE BECAME A THEATER
FOR MUSCLE-FLEXING. WE NOW FEEL THAT THE BUSH ADMINISTRATION IS
GOING TO BE MORE RATIONAL IN HANDLING ISSUES WHICH THE FORMER
ADMINISTRATION THOUGHT COULD BE DEALT WITH BY FORCE.
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ATTN JORDAN AAMM
SERIAL: JN2910100689
REF: JN2810183089 CAIRO AL-MUSAWWAR ARABIC 27 OCT///WITH BY
FORCE.
TEXT:
((TEXT)) AL-MUSAWWAR: YOUR EXCELLENCY THE COLONEL, THE WORLD IS
CURRENTLY EXPERIENCING A STAGE OF RADICAL CHANGES. THE USSR HAS
WITHDRAWN INTO ITS OWN SHELL AS A RESULT OF ITS INTERNAL PROBLEMS.
IT GIVES PRIORITY TO ITS ECONOMIC PROBLEMS OVER ANY OF THE REGIONAL
PROBLEMS FROM WHICH THE WORLD IS SUFFERING, IN ADDITION TO ITS
STRONG CONCERN ABOUT DETENTE. IN EASTERN EUROPE, THE WINDS OF
CHANGE ARE BLOWING CALLING FOR A DEMOCRATIC FORM OF GOVERNMENT AND
FOR ENDING THE RULE OF ONE PARTY IN FAVOR OF THE MULTI-PARTY SYSTEM.
WHAT IMPACT DO THESE RADICAL CHANGES HAVE ON THE COLONEL'S VIEWS,
AND THEN ON OUR ARAB WORLD?
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THE COLONEL: WITHOUT UNDUE ASSUMPTION OR EXAGGERATION, IN 1969
AND 1970, I PREDICTED WHAT WOULD HAPPEN IN THE USSR. I CLEARLY SAID
IN THE THIRD CHAPTER OF THE GREEN BOOK THAT I AM AFRAID THAT
CONFLICT AMONG NATIONALITIES WOULD FRAGMENT THE UNITY OF THE USSR IN
THE NEAR FUTURE. HOWEVER, ALTHOUGH WHAT YOU HAVE SAID IS TRUE, THE
USSR WILL NOT GIVE U: ITS SUPPORT FOR ARAB RIGHTS AND THE PAL':STINE
QUESTION.
AL-MUSAWWAR: BUT WHAT IS HAPPENING IS THAT THE USSR SUPPORTS A
PEACEFUL SETTLEMENT WITHOUT HAVING SUFFICIENT ABILITY TO GUARANTEE
THE SOUND AND JUST CONDITIONS FOR THIS POLITICAL SETTLEMENT.
THE COLONEL: THIS IS THE USSR'S POLICY. IT BELIEVES IN SETTLING
ALL REGIONAL PROBLEMS THROUGH PEACEFUL MEANS. HOWEVER, THIS DOES
NOT MEAN THAT ALL THE EXISTING CONTRADICTIONS BETWEEN THE USSR AND
THE UNITED STATES HAVE GONE WITH THE WIND.
AL-MUSAWWAR: WHAT IS THE NATURE OF YOUR RELATIONS NOW WITH THE
USSR? IS IT TRUE THAT IT REFUSES TO SUPPLY YOU WITH ARMS UNLESS YOU
PAY IN CASH AND IN DOLLARS?
THE COLONEL: OUR RELATIONS ARE GOOD. WHAT YOU ARE SAYING IS NOT
TRUE. MOREOVER, LIBYA DID NOT REQUEST NEW ARMS. WHAT WE HAVE IS
SUFFICIENT. I BELIEVE THAT THE CURRENT STAGE NECESSITATE THAT WE
CONCENTRATE ON THE REQUIREMENTS OF ECONOMIC PROGRESS, AND NOT ON
PURCHASING ARMS.
AL-MUSAWWAR: DO YOU THINK THAT THE CURRENT CIRCUMSTANCES IN IRAN
NECESSITATE THE REACTIVATION OF THE ARAB-IRANIAN DIALOGUE TO PUT THE
ARAB-PERSIAN RELATIONS ON THE RIGHT COURSE?
THE COLONEL: I BELIEVE IT IS NECESSARY TO HAVE SOUND NEIGHBORLY
RELATIONS BETWEEN IRAN AND THE ARABS. PERHAPS, DIALOGUE WOULD HELP
IRAN MOVE TO MODERATION DESPITE THE FACT THAT INTERNAL CONFLICT
STILL EXISTS AMONG THE LOYALISTS TO THE MODERATE LINE AND THE
REVOLUTIONARY GUARDS MEN, WHO ARE A MILLION VOLUNTEERS, WHO CALL FOR
ABIDING BY KHOMEYNI'S COURSE.
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WARNING: ATTN TEL AVIV DFDF
ATTN JORDAN AAMM
SERIAL: JN2910102089
REF: JN2810183089 CAIRO AL-MUSAWWAR ARABIC 27 OCT///BY
KHOMEYNI'S CAUSE.
TEXT:
((TEXT)) AL-MUSAWWAR: YOUR EXCELLENCY THE COLONEL. I HAVE A
QUESTION WHICH I AM SURE MUST BE ON THE MINDS OF MANY AND THAT IS
WHY, OF ALL ARAB LEADERS, DO YOU INSIST ON HAVING A PERSONAL
BODYGUARD OF WOMEN?
THE COLONEL: THOSE IN CHARGE OF MY PERSONAL SAFETY ARE LIBYAN
YOUTHS WHO HAVE VOLUNTEERED THEIR SERVICES AND THEY ARE OF BOTH
SEXES. THE GIRS MAY BE MORE CONSPICUOUS ON ACCOUNT OF THEIR
DRESSES. I CONSENTED TO THE SERVICES OF THESE WOMEN VOLUNTEERS SO
THEY MAY SERVE AS ROLE MODELS AND SHOW THAT LIBYAN WOMEN CAN COPE
WITH ALL THE TASKS THAT THEY MAY BE ENTRUSTED WITH. WE DO NOT
DISTINGUISH BETWEEN MEN AND WOMEN IN TERMS OF PAY OR WORK AS A
WHOLE. WE NOW HAVE GIRLS RECEIVING TRAINING AS AIR FORCE PILOTS.
AL-MUSAWWAR: YOUR EXCELLENCY THE COLONEL. WHEN WILL YOUR NEXT
MEETING WITH PRESIDENT MUBARAK BE?
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THE COLONEL: WE HAVE AGREED THAT WE MAY MEET ANYPLACE AND UNDER
ALL KINDS OF CIRCUMSTANCES. WE MAY ARRANGE A MEETING OVER THE
TELEPHONE.
AL-MUSAWWAR: YOUR EXCELLLENCY THE COLONEL. IS THERE ANYTHING TO
PREVENT AN ISRAELI-PALESTINIAN DIALOGUE?
THE COLONEL: THIS IS UP TO THE PALESTINIANS, AND THERE IS NO
REASON WHY THE PALESTINIANS SHOULD NOT SIT FOR TALKS WITH THE
ISRAELIS. IT HAPPENS IN EVERY CORNER OF THE GLOBE.
AL-MUSAWWAR: WHAT WOULD YOU LIKE TO SAY TO THE EGYPTIANS?
THE COLONEL: I WOULD LIKE TO TELL THEM THAT WE ARE ONE PEOPLE
BOUND TOGETHER BY NEIGHBORLINESS AND GEOGRAPHY. THE BARBED WIRE
KEEPING AS APART ARE ONLY ARTIFICIAL BARRIERS. I WOULD ALSO LIKE TO
SAY THAT WE HAVE NO PROBLEM WITH EGYPT AND HAD NO PROBLEMS WITH
RELATIONS WITH EGYPT. OUR DISAGREEMENT CONCERNED A PAN-ARAB ISSUE
AND PRESIDENT 1UBARAK AND I HAVE REACHED UNDERSTANDING ON THAT. I
WOULD LIKE TO SAY THAT LIBYA IS THE POINT OF CONTACT BETWEEN THE
ARAB EAST AND ARAB WEST. THE LINKING CHAIN MUST BE STRONG AND
EFFECTIVE. THE STRENGTH OF THIS CHAIN DERIVES FROM OUR FATEFUL
ASSOCIATION WITH EGYPT. I SEE THE ARAB WORLD AS A BODY WHOSE HEART
IS EGYPT, LIBYA, AND SUDAN AND WINGS ARE THE EASTERN AND WESTERN
ENDS OF THE ARAB HOMELAND. WE, THEREFORE, THINK THAT OUR EFFORTS ON
BEHALF OF ARAB UNITY SHOULD NOT CEASE. THE THING IS THAT WE MUST
GET THE FIRST STEPS RIGHT AND START AT OUR MASSES' COMMON INTERESTS.
I THINK THAT WE HAVE MADE THE RIGHT STEP ALONG THAT ROAD IN THE
ACHIEVEMENT WE MADE IN MARSA MATRUH AND TOBRUK.
AL-MUSAWWAR: YOUR EXCELLENCY THE COLONEL. THANK YOU FOR YOUR
TIME.
ADMIN
(ENDALL) 27 OCT AH/JABIR/MS 29/1038Z OCT P082910.15
BT
M392
PAAUZYUW RUQMIFA0392 3021036 MTMS-UUAA
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