AMBASSADOR KIRKPATRICK'S LUNCH CONVERSATION WITH ROBERTO D'AUBUISSON AND ARENA LEADERS

• Document Type: CREST
• Collection: General CIA Records
• Document Number (FOIA) /ESDN (CREST): CIA-RDP85M00363R001102380010-0
• Release Decision: RIPPUB
• Original Classification: C
• Document Page Count: 7
• Document Creation Date: December 22, 2016
• Document Release Date: September 1, 2010
• Sequence Number: 10
• Publication Date: February 14, 1983
• Content Type: CABLE

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83 0506148 SCP
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PP RUEAIIA
DE RUEHCV #1249/01 0451328
ZNY CCCCC ZZH
P 141320Z FEB 83
FM AMEMBASSY CARACAS
TO RUEHC/SECSTATE WASHDC PRIORITY 4211
INFO RUEAIIA/CIA WASHDC
RUEADPW/AHITEHOUSE WASHDC
RUEHCR/AMEMBASSY BELIZE 0140
RUESBG/AMEMBASSY BOGOTA 6410
RUEHGT/AMEM8ASSY GUATEMALA 1404
RUESMG/AMEMBA$SY MANAGUA 1446
RUEHME/AMEMBASSY MEXICO 0987
RUEHZP/AMEMBASSY PANAMA 5103
RUEHSN/AMEMMHASSY SAN SALVADOR 1237
RUEHSJ/AMEMBASSY SAN JOSE 1767
RUESSD/AMEMBASSY SANTO DOMINGO 1597
RUESTE/AMEMBASSY TEGUCIGALPA 1090
RUEHDT/USMISSION USUN NEW YORK 7979
RUEHUB/USINT HAVANA 0642
BT
C 0 N F I D E N T I A L CARACAS 01249
DEPARTMENT FOR ENDERS
WHITE HOUSE FOR CLARK
CIA FOR DIRECTOR CASEY
E.O. 12356: DECL: OADR
TAGS: OVIP (KIRKPATRICK, JEANE), PREL, XK, US, ES, VE
SUBJECT: AMBASSADOR KIRKPATRICK'S LUNCH CONVERSATION
CONFIDENTIAL
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TORS 1413452 FEB 83
? WITH ROBERTO D'AUBUI33ON AND ARENA LEADERS
1. (CONFIDENTIAL - ENTIRE TEXT)
2. SUMMARY, AT LUNCH FEBRUARY 9 WITH AMBASSADOR
KIRKPATRICK, ARENA LEADER ROBERTO D'AUBUISSON AND FIVE
OTHER ARENA COHORTS GAVE AMBASSADOR KIRKPATRICK A FULL
DOSE OF THEIR KIND OF MEDICINE, ARENA THEMES REMAIN
CONSTANT: THE MILITARY STOLE THE PRESIDENCY FROM
THEM LAST APRIL, INCOMPETENT LEADERSHIP IS PROLONGING
THE WAR. IN FACT, IT IS LOSING THE WAR. TO WIN THE
OAR IT IS MOST IMPORTANT TO REACTIVATE THE ECONOMY
WHICH WAS DESTROYED BY THE PDC.REFORM PROCESS. DEFENSE
MINISTER JOSE GUILLERMO GARCIA HAS TO GO. HE IS A
POLITICIAN NOT A MILITARY LEADER. CORRUPTION IS
RAMPANT AND AMONG THE MOST CORRUPT IS GARCIA. WHILE
ARENA'S HIGH LEVEL OF PIQUE AT EVERYTHING REMAINS HIGH,
CLEARLY THE FOCUS OF THEIR DISLIKE RIGHT NOW IS THE
DEFENSE MINISTER. END SUMMARY.
3. AMBASSADOR HINTON HOSTED LUNCH IN HONOR OF U.S.
UNITED NATIONS REPRESENTATIVE AMBASSADOR JEANS J.
KIRKPATRICK WITH MAJOR ROBERTO D'AUBUISSON, ARENA CHIEF
AND PRESIDENT OF THE CONSTITUENT ASSEMBLY, ALSO
ATTENDING WERE MAURICIO GUTIERREZ CASTRO, SECOND VICE
PRESIDENT OF THE REPUBLIC; HUGO BARRERA, ARENA VICE
PRESIDENT AND 1ST FIRST SECRETARY OF THE CONSTITUENT
ASSEMBLY; RENE BARRIOS AMAYA, LEADER OF THE ARENA LABOR
SECTOR AND 2ND FIRST SECRETARY OF THE CONSTITUENT
ASSEMBLY= GLORIA SALGUERA GROSS, 3RD SECOND SECRETARY
OF THE CONSTITUENT ASSEMBLY. ON THE AMERICAN SIDE,
BESIDES THE AMBASSADORS, WERE ROGER FONTAINE OF THE
NSC, THE DCM, AND THE POLCOUNS.
4. D'AUBUISSON STARTED THE CONVERSATION WITH A LONG
STATEMENT. HE SAID THAT ARENA, AS OPPOSED TO THE
CHRISTIAN DEMOCRATS, BELIEVED IN LEARNING FROM THE
PAST, NOT RENOUNCING IT. WHILE ARENA MIGHT BE A
RIGHTIST PARTY, THIS RIGHTIST PARTY HAD BEEN THE FIRST
TO PROPOSE, LAST JUNE, AN AMNESTY LAW. IT HAD BEEN
OPPOSED BY THE MINISTER OF DEFENSE AND THEREFORE GOT
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83 0506148 SCP PAGE 003 NC 0506148
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NOWHERE, THIS COMING WEEK ARENA WILL PROPOSE IN THE
CONSTITUENT ASSEMbLY DRAFT LEGISLATION THAT THE FOR
BE INSCRIBED AS A LEGITIMATE POLITICAL FORCE IN THE
COUNTRY, D'AUBUISSON SAID THAT IF THE FDR CAN WIN AN
ELECTION WITH VOTES, ARENA WOULD RESPECT THAT VICTORY.
HE WENT ON TO TALK ABOUT WHY ARENA HAS SUCH A BAD NAME
IN THE UNITED STATES, HE SAID THAT THE STATE DEPARTMENT
POLICY IN THE LAST ELECTIONS MAD BEEN FOR THE PDC TO
WIN. AMBASSADOR HINTON TOLD D'AUBUISSON ABOUT THE
CONVERSATION HE MAD HAD WITH THEN JRG PRESIDENT DUARTE
IN DECEMBER 1981, HE HAD TOLD DUARTE THAT HE DID NOT
THINK THE CHRISTIAN DEMOCRATS COULD WIN THE ELECTION.
DUARTE REPLIED THAT THAT WAS THE WHOLE IDEA; THE
CHRISTIAN DEMOCRATS HAD NO INTENTION OF WINNING THE
ELECTIONS, LEAVING THAT POINT BEHIND D'AUBUISSON NEXT
SAID THAT THE "PDC REFORMS" HAD BEEN VERY BAD FOR THE
COUNTRY. THE WORST OF THE THREE MAJOR REFORMS WERE
THE BANK REFORMS AND THE REFORM OF THE FOREIGN TRADE
SECTOR. ARENA RECOGNIZED THE NEED FOR BETTER DISTRI-
BUTION OF LAND BUT THE WAY IT HAD BEEN CARRIED OUT IN
EL SALVADOR WAS A TECHNICAL DISASTER, ME FINISHED BY
EMPHASIZING THAT UNDER THE PRESENT LEADERSHIP (READ
DEFENSE MINISTER JOSE GUILLERMO GARCIA) THE WAR CANNOT
BE WON.
5. AMBASSADOR KIRKPATRICK TOLD D'AUBUISSON THAT SHE
AGREED WITH HIM ON TOO POINTS. THE FIRST IS THAT THE
MILITARY STRUGGLE IS IMPORTANT, NOT ONLY FOR EL SALVADOR
BUT FOR MANY OTHER COUNTRIES. IT IS ESPECIALLY IMPORTANT
FOR EL SALVADOR'S NEIGHBORS WHO SEE THEIR FORTUNES
CLOSELY TIED TO THAT OF THIS COUNTRY. SECOND,
GUERRILLA WARFARE IS A POLITICAL PHENOMENON IN ORIGIN,
IT IS A VERY DIFFERENT TYPE OF WARFARE. ONCE STARTED,
HOWEVER, SOCIAL/ECONOMIC PROBLEMS BECOME IMPORTANT IN
THIS KIND OF WARFARE.
6, AMBASSADOR KIRKPATRICK THEN REMARKED THAT FOR
HER THERE ARE ONLY TWO SYSTEMS OF POLITICS: THE
POLITICS OF CONSENT AND THE POLITICS OF VIOLENCE.
DEMOCRACY, THE POLITICS OF CONSENT, DOES DEMAND THAT
THE POPULATION HAVE ACCESS TO WORK AND ENJOY SOME OF
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??--?-? ??---?~~??----~~~~- ?-?-S---w-?~55?~?555??~~5~e~e?S-. 055-SS555~~?.U
THE BENEFITS OF ECONOMIC PROGRESS. IT IS A TRAGEDY,
SHE NOTED, THAT WE ARE LETTING THE' NICARAGUANS TAKE
SO MUCH CREDIT FOR TEACHING THEIR PEOPLE TO READ AND
FOR TEACHING THEM PROPER DIETARY PRACTICES TO AVOID
MALNUTRITION. THEN SHE SAID THAT SHE RESPECTED ANY
GROUP THAT LIMITS ITSELF TO DEMOCRATIC MEANS IN ORDER
TO ACHIEVE ITS ENDS,
7. AMBASSADOR HINTON ASKED OF WHAT USE IS IT TO LEARN
TO READ AND WRITE IF THE ONLY READING MATERIAL AVAILABLE
ARE MARXIST TRACTS, HIS POINT, HE SAID, WAS TO POINT
OJT THAT IN EL SALVADOR THERE IS RELATIVELY LITTLE
CENSURE OF WHAT IS AVAILABLE TO READ.
8. D'AUBUISSON NOTED THAT A LITERACY CAMPAIGN, BOTH
FUR CHILDREN AND ADULTS, HAD EXISTED IN EL SALVADOR
FOR YEARS. BARRERA INTERRUPTED TO POINT OUT THAT
COMMUNISTS KNOW HOW TO TAKE ADVANTAGE OF WHATEVER
WEAKNESSES THERE ARE IN A DEMOCRATIC SYSTEM. ARENA
BELIEVES THAT BOTH ILLITERACY AND MALNUTRITION COULD
BE OVERCOME IN EL SALVADOR IF THE FUNDS EXISTED FOR
SUCH PROGRAMS FROM EITHER NATIONAL OR INTERNATIONAL
SOURCES AND THE GOVERNMENT IN POWER WAS DETERMINED
TO ERADICATE THESE SCOURGES. HE ALSO ADVOCATED A
MORE COMPREHENSIVE PROGRAM IN THE PUBLIC HEALTH AREA
BECAUSE THE NEGLECT OF PUBLIC HEALTH CREATES A
SICKLY POPULATION WHICH IS AN EVER INCREASING BURDEN
ON THE GOVERNMENT. AMBASSADOR MINION COMMENTED THAT
ALL THESE PROGRAMS, THE REFORMS INCLUDED, ARE IMPORTANT,
TO GAIN POPULAR SUPPORT NECESSARY TO WIN THE WAR.
9, AMBASSADOR KIRKPATRICK OBSERVED THAT GUERRILLA
WAR IS NOT WON BY POPULAR SUPPORT ALONE; GUERRILLAS
WIN WARS BY VIOLENCE. THUS THE MILITARY ASPECT OF THE
WAR IS THE MOST IMPORTANT IN THE SHORT RUN. IF THE
GOVERNMENT LOSES MILITARILY NONE OF THE OTHER PROGRAMS
MATTER. SHE THEN TURNED TO D'AUBUISSON AND INQUIRED
WHAT HIS VIEWS WERE ON THE TACTICS FOR WINNING THE WAR.
SHE UNDERSTOOD THAT HIS VIEWS WERE DIFFERENT FROM
THOSE OF THE GOVERNMENT. D'AUBUISSON REPLIED THAT
HIS VIEWS HERE CERTAINLY DIFFERENT FROM THOSE OF
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GENERAL GARCIA. THIS IS NOT WORLD WAR III THIS IS
NOT THE WAR OF LARGE OPERATIONS; THIS IS A WAR OF
PROPAGANDA WHERE THE MOTIVATIONS OF THE GUERRILLAS
HAVE TO BE STUDIED. HE CRITICIZED THE HIGH COMMAND
FOR ALLOWING TOO MUCH INFORMATION ON ITS PROPOSED
OPERATIONS TO LEAK TO THE ENEMY. THE GOVERNMENT IS
ALLOWING THE GUERRILLA TACTIC OF PROLONGING WARFARE
TO TAKE PLACE. THIS WAR SHOULD BE SHORT, "LIGHTENING
QUICK." GARCIA HAS ALLOWED IT TO BE PROLONGED.
D'AUBUISSON ALLEGED THAT GARCIA HAD ALLOWED LEFTIST
LEADER SALVADOR SAMAYOA TO LEAVE THE COUNTRY IN 1980.
HE CRITICIZED GARCIA FOR LETTING ONLY THE SON OF
PROMINENT CHRISTIAN DEMOCRAT ANTONIO MORALES EHRLICH
TO BE RELEASED FROM PRISON OF ALL THE POLITICAL
PRISONERS. HE CLAIMED THAT SALVADORAN COMMUNIST
PARTY SECRETARY GENERAL'SHAFIK HANDAL HAD TOLD A
PUBLIC MEETING AT THE NATIONAL UNIVERSITY CAMPUS IN
1980 OF HIS ADMIRATION FOR GARCIA, THAT HE WOULD
'BURN HIS HANDS" FOR HIM. THE U.S. HAS BACKED THE
WRONG MAN--GARCIA. HE IS A CAPABLE, SHREWD MAN, BUT
HE IS SINISTER (NEFASTO). IN REPLY TO AMBASSADOR
HINTON'S QUESTION, D'AUBUISSON SAID THAT THE RECENT
CHANGES IN THE MINISTRY OF DEFENSE WERE GOOD--"VERY
GOOD."
10. RENE BARRIOS AMAYA THEN ENTERED THE CONVERSATION.
HE NOTED THAT IN A WAR WORKING PEOPLE SUFFER MORE THAN
ANYBODY, THEN HE GAVE A RAMBLING ACCOUNT OF THE
INTERNATIONAL LABOR MOVEMENT SINCE WORLD WAR II. HE
CONCLUDED THAT THE COMMUNISTS WERE SUCCESSFUL IN THE
INTERNATIONAL LABOR MOVEMENT BECAUSE THE DEMOCRATIC
LABOR ORGANIZATIONS WERE NOT SUFFICIENTLY AGGRESSIVE.
HE THEN DECLARED THAT (1) THE GOVERNMENT WAS LOSING
THE WAR AND (2) THE U.S.'IS NOT REALISTIC IN ITS
ASSESSMENT OF EL SALVADOR. AMBASSADOR KIRKPATRICK
ASKED IF THOSE ASSEMBLED REALLY BELIEVED THAT.
D'AUBUISSON REPLIED THAT IT 18 'REAL.' THIS IS A
GOVERNMENT IMPOSED BY GARCIA LAST APRIL. THEN SPEAKING
TONGUE IN CHEEK HE OFFERED A SOLUTION TO THE CENTRAL
AMERICAN PROBLEM. LET THE FMLN WIN AND RECOGNIZE
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MOSCOW AS THE DOMINANT POWER IN THE REGION, "BUT
GIVE US SALVADORANS AT LEAST PART OF SOUTHERN
CALIFORNIA. PERHAPS WE CAN TAKE A FEW DOCUMENTS
WITH US AND IMPOSE A LAND REFORM WHEN WE GET THERE."
TURNING SERIOUS D'AUSU133ON DECLARED THAT THE ECONOMIC
WAR WAS THE MOST IMPORTANT PART OF THE STRUGGLE.
Its D'AUBUISSON TOOK THE EXAMPLE OF PHASE II OF THE
AGRARIAN REFORM AS ILLUSTRATIVE. "IT HANGS OVER THE
ECONOMY LIKE THE SWORD OF DAMOCLES." D'AUBUISSON INSISTED
THAT THE POLITICAL AND ECONOMIC ASPECTS OF THE WAR WERE
MORE IMPORTANT THAN THE MILITARY, ONCE.AGAIN HE DECLARED
THAT THE THREAT OF INVOKING PHASE 11 OF THE LAND REFORM
WAS A DEAD WEIGHT ON THE ECONOMY.
12. HUGO BARRERA SAID THAT MANY PEOPLE OUTSIDE OF EL
SALVADOR ASSUMED THAT THIS COUNTRY HAD NO FUNCTIONING
ECONOMIC SYSTEM PRIOR TO THE COUP, THAT IS NOT TRUE;
EL SALVADOR HAD A THRIVING ECONOMIC. SYSTEM, BUT OVER THE
LAST FEW YEARS GOVERNMENT POLICIES HAD EFFECTIVELY
DESTROYED IT. EL.SALVADOR MUST HAVE A SOUND ECONOMIC
POLICY ALONG WITH A SOUND MILITARY POLICY, NOT "STUPID"
ONES LIKE NOW, GIVEN SOUND POLICIES EL SALVADOR COULD
SOLVE MANY OF ITS OWN PROBLEMS AND WITH A GREAT DEAL
LESS U.S. MONEY REQUIRED. THE RULES OF THE GAME HAVE
TO BE CLEARLY LAID OUT AND RESPECTED BY EVERYBODY.
EL SALVADOR AT THIS MOMENT COULD USE AN "INJECTION" OF
MONEY ON THE ORDER TO ONE BILLION DOLLARS WHICH IS
CERTAINLY LESS THAN THE COUNTRY LOST BECAUSE OF THE
REFORM PROCESS, VICE PRESIDENT GUTIERREZ CASTRO CHIPPED
IN WITH AN ATTACK ON PHASE II. HE ALSO SAID THAT PHASE
III UNDER DECREE 207 IS "TERRIBLE" 6ECAUSE IT AFFECTS
NOT WEALTHY LAND OWNERS BUT MORE COMMON FOLK OF A LOWER
ECONOMIC ORDER. HE CHARACTERIZED PHASE II LAND REFORM
AS "CRIMINAL." GUTIERREZ CASTRO PROCEEDED TO ATTACK
GARCIA AND "THAT DEMAGOGUE" LTCOL GALILEO TORRES FOR
IMPOSING PHASE III LAND REFORM ON THE COUNTRY, (EMBASSY
SAN SALVADOR NOTE: LTCOL GALILEO TORRES IS THE PRESIDENT
OF FINATA, THE GOES AGENCY RESPONSIBLE FOR IMPLEMENTING
PHASE III.)
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13. D'AUBUISSON NEXT POSED THREE QUESTIONS:
-?HOW IS IT POSSIBLE THAT THE. GOES HAS RECEIVED MORE
MILITARY ASSISTANCE THAN AT ANY TIME DURING ITS HISTORY
AND YET THE RELATIVE STRENGTH OF THE GUERRILLAS IS
GREATER THAN EVER?
--WHAT 18 THE POINT OF WINNING THE WAR IF WHAT COMES OUT
OF THIS STRUGGLE ARE PROGRAMS THAT ARE THE SAME AS WHAT
THE MARXISTS WOULD HAVE IMPOSED?
--HOW CAN WE WIN THE WAR BY BORROWING MONEY THAT WE
CANNOT REPAY?
NEVERTHELESS D'AUBUISSON CHARACTERIZED HIMSELF AS AN
OPTIMIST. "WE ARE GOING TO WIN THIS WAR. THE PEOPLE
HAVE NO WORK AND NO SECURITY." HE THEN DECLARED THAT
IF THE SUBVERSIVES TAKE OVER "WE" WILL BECOME GUERRILLAS
IF NECESSARY ON GUAZAPA VOLCANO. HE SAID HE FULLY
INTENDED TO DIE IN THIS COUNTRY. HE FINISHED THE
LUNCHEON CONVERSATION BY DECLARING AGAINST WHAT HE
DESCRIBED AS RAMPANT CORRUPTION IN THE GOVERNMENT AT
ALL LEVELS. AMONG THE MOST CORRUPT IN HIS ESTIMATION
IS DEFENSE MINISTER GARCIA.
14. AMBASSADOR KIRKPATRICK CONCLUDED BY STRESSING
THE NECESSITY FOR ALL PARTIES TO REMAIN IN THE
DEMOCRATIC PROCESS AND USE DEMOCRATIC MEANS TO
RESOLVE CONFLICTS. SHE TOLD D'AUBUISSON THAT SHE HAD
HEARD IN SEVERAL PLACES THAT D'AUBUISSON WAS A
TERRORIST, A MAN WHO USES VIOLENCE TO ACHIEVE HIS
GOALS, WHO INTIMIDATED HIS OPPONENTS WITH THREATS OF
THE USE OF FORCE. THE PEOPLE OF EL SALVADOR HAD MADE
IT CLEAR TO ITS LEADERS THAT DEMOCRACY WAS THE
PROCESS THEY DESIRED. SHE TOLD D'AUBUISSON THAT SHE
HOPED ARENA WOULD REMAIN WITHIN THE DEMOCRATIC PROCESS.
D'AUBUISSON ASSURED HER ARENA WOULD 00 909 LANDAU
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