FUROR HITS CIA SOURCES, COLBY SAYS
Document Type:
Collection:
Document Number (FOIA) /ESDN (CREST):
CIA-RDP99-00418R000100100033-5
Release Decision:
RIPPUB
Original Classification:
K
Document Page Count:
4
Document Creation Date:
December 22, 2016
Document Release Date:
May 11, 2012
Sequence Number:
33
Case Number:
Publication Date:
March 20, 1975
Content Type:
OPEN SOURCE
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Body:
STAT
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Q and A
tar
1its I
19 ~~Jflcy CIA Dunces,
Ccy Says
. William Colby, director of the Cen-
tral Intelligence Agency, was interview-
ed by Washington Star Staff Writer Je-
remiah O'Leary.
Question: Clark Clifford, who as
counsel to President Truman partici-
pated in writing the law which estab-
lished the CIA, said recently that the
ground rules need to be updated, to
be renovated. Do you concur with
that view?
Colby: Well, I've made certain
recommendations for changing our
act already. A year and a half ago
when I was confirmed. I suggested
that we add the word "foreign" to the
word "intelligence" wherever it ap-
pears in our act so it's clear it's for-
eign intelligence that's the job of this
agency and not domestic. I recom-
mended other things to clarify
exactly what the CIA ought to be able
to do in the United States and what it
should not be able to do in the United
States.
Q: That requires an act of Con-
gress?
A: Yes. It hasn't been passed, but
there was legislation last year - I
supported it - and I'm sure these
(congressional investigating) com-
mittees will get into a rather funda-
mental look at some of these ques-
tions.
Q: Would you ever go out of the
business of operating in terms of
your own security within the United
States, in places like New York
where the U.N. is located, or in
places like Miami, where there are.
many Cubans?
A: Well, I think, in the first place,
that we ought to be able to collect for-
eigi intelligence in America. I think
we ought to collect it voluntarily
from Aritericans, and we ought to be
able to collect it from foreigners.
Q: Interviewing returned travel-
ers ?
A: That sort of thing, yes. We do a
great deal of that, and there are an
awful lot of Americans who very
kindly help us and support us on this.
We do make commitments that we
won't expose them as our sources.
That's going to be one of the things
I'm insisting on - that we not expose
them in the course of these investiga-
20 MARCH 1975
tions. And I think I've received a
very sympathetic response from Sen.
Church on this. If there's a reasona-
ble basis for our withholding an iden-
tity or something, he certainly has
given every indication that he will
give full consideration to that.
Q: Given the scrutiny by the,
Rockefeller commission, by several
committees of Congress, by the press
- can the CIA operate effectively as
a clandestine service under these
conditions?
A: Well, it's having a hard time.
We have a number of individual
agents abroad who have told us that
they really don't want to work for us
anymore.
Q: Agents?
A: Foreigners, working foreigners.
We have had a number of Americans
who have indicated that they don't
want to work with us anymore - not
employes, but Americans who have
helped us in various ways. We have a
number of foreign intelligence serv-
ices that have indicated great con-
cern about collaboration with us -
whether this will be exposed, and
they will be subjected to intense:
criticism in their country. I
think this is a very serious
problem for our country.
We are in the process of los-
ing some of the information
that otherwise we would be
getting.
Q: You mean that some of
these other services and
other individuals are no
longer confident?
A: They're beginning to
pull back, or some of them
have just stopped working
with us. And, of course,
more serious and yet not
measurable is the number
who would have agreed to
work with us, but now won't
agree to work with us. I
have seen a couple of cases
where individuals had indi-
cated they thought they
would work with us, and
then came around here very
recently and said, "I know I
did agree, but I don't think I
will."
Q: Have your actual
operations overseas been
.affected by the current
furor?
A: Oh, yes, I think the
current furor has laid a par-
ticular problem on us in
that people exaggerate CIA.
I see that in Mexico there
was an accusation this
week that we organized the
excitement at the universi-
ty, which, of course, we had
nothing to do with. We also
have the problem that CIA
is used as a shibboleth to
shout about in various coun-
tries around the world. And
I think we have a more seri-
ous problem: We have to
consider carefully whether
we want to help somebody
and take a risk of destroy-
ing him in the process of
helping him. Because if it
leaks that we helped him at
this stage, we may destroy
his political position entire-
ly.
Q: What has been the ef-
fect of books like that of
Philip Agee which give
names and a great number
of identities?
A: Well, I think that's
absolutely unconscionable
and reprehensible for an
officer who served with us,
accepted our discipline,
agreed with our activities,
signed a very warm and
friendly letter on his resig-
nation indicating that he
valued highly his associa-
tion with us, and that he
would forever maintain the
relationship as one of pride
and trust, that if he could
ever do anything for us he
would be happy to . . . I've
got an idea or so as to what
he might do. He has named
every name he could think
of that was anyhow associ-
ated with us. There is-at
least one family who has
been put under consider-
able pressure as a result of
this. A girl hounded out of
school because her father's
name appears in it. We
have had to make rather
massive changes in our
situation in that area to pre-
vent people being subjected
to hardships because of this
revelation. And the danger
is that this kind of thing can
go into. the whole action of
various terrorist move-
ments. Mr. Mitrione, as you
know, was murdered in
Latin America. There is a
school of thought that says
that was a patriotic act be- ,
cause he was alleged to be a
CIA officer. He was not a
CIA officer. And I contend
that that kind of a murder is
totally unjustifiable. But
Mr. Agee has put a number
of people under direct
threat of exactly that thing
happening to them.
A: Well, the fact is, as
I've said many times - I
don't want to talk about the
details of our activity there
- CIA had nothing to do
with the coup that over-
threw Mr. -Allende.' It had
nothing to do with the mili-
tary at that time. We had a
program of trying to sup-
port and assist some of the
democratic forces looking
to the elections of 1976,
which we hoped they would
win against Mr. Allende.
The fact was. however, his
policies were such that he
generated so much confu-
sion in the country - not
created by CIA - that the
military did move against
him. If you ask whether
that was a CIA success or
failure, I would say it was a
failure, because the pro-
gram we had in mind did
not take place, which was
that the democratic forces
would succeed eventually
through elections in Chile.
Q: Was the agency aware
that the Chilean armed
forces intended to move
when they did?
A: We had certain intelli-
gence coverage of it and we
had a series of alerts indi-
cating that it was about to
happen. They key to it was
whether several different
forces would get together to
do it, and we had several in-
dications that they would on
a certain date and then they
didn't. And then they would;
on another date, and then
they didn't. And then that
they would in September
and they did.
Q: Did the junta ask the
United States or the CIA
whether the new regime -
would be recognized?
A: They certainly did not
ask the CIA, and I don't
know of any other requests.
Q: There have been a
number of reports that you
gave a verbal addendum to
President Ford after sub-
mitting your 50-page report
involving the word "assas-
sination." Did you make
such a report?
A: I think I'll let the
President speak for himself
Q: A couple of years ago, on that. He has spoken on it,
there was a similar furor and I think it's appropriate.
and public investigation in-, Otherwise, I frankly think
volving the agency and ITT 'that this is a subject that I
in Chile. l hat is the truth. would like to just stay in a
about the agency's role in total no comment position.
Chirp 7
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! _L-9 1111 IIIIIIIIIII[IIIII .I III III'
material still be segregat-
ed. And I look forward to
the day after the investiga-
tions when we have one
large bonfire and destroy it
all. Because I don't think
that we ought to have it and
I think that the best disposi-
tion is to get rid of it.
Q: Under the Organiza-
tion Act of 1947, is mail
cover in the United States
illegal?
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Q: Well, there have been
a number of allegations that
the agency either had
knowledge or discussions
involving assassinations,
the ones that took place in-
volving Trujillo and
Lumumba,. and plans or
plots involving Castro and
Duvalier. What's your re-
sponse to that?
A: Well, again, I really
don't want to comment
about that subject. It will be
reported fully to the select A: In my view, we should
committees. This is not a
subject that I think we not do it. And that is why I
would do any good to the recommended its termina-
United States by talking tion in 1973 and it was
about. terminated by Dr. Schles-
abinger.
Q: Can you say flatly that Q: But that's not quite re-
the CIA has never planned sponsive. Is it illegal under
the assassination of any for6 the mandate?
eign leader?
A: Again, I just don't
want to comment at all on
it.
Q: You've discounted re-
ports of sweeping CIA
domestic activity but the
issue remains very much
alive. What's likely to be
the upshot of that?
A: I think that the results
of the investigation will
rather clearly show that
I'm right, that the program
that we undertook to identi-
fy foreign links with Ameri-
can dissident movements 1
was not a massive one, in i
the numbers involved; was
not a domestic one, because
it was basically foreign;
and it wasn't illegal be-
cause it was under our
charter and our National
Security Act. So it was nei-
ther massive, illegal nor
domestic. It was an intelli-
gence operation.
Q: A great deal of the
controversy focuses on files)
with the names of U.S. citi-
zens. What steps have been
taken, if any, to cleanse
these files?
A: Opening mail is, I be-
lieve, illegal. Reading the
addresses off mail I think
would depend on the author-
ity of the organization in
question. We're not doing it
- but I could imagine that
it would be, legitimate to
look at the addresses of peo-
ple in contact with known
foreign intelligence serv-
ices or something of that
nature.
A: No, it's not. It depends
on why. As I told Mrs.
Abzug, if we were watching
a foreign organization over-
seas seas and she ran into con-
tact with it and it was re-
ported, I would probably
have her name in the files.
And we so did. We had her
name for that reason. We
have coverage of foreign
meetings, things like that
abroad. A certain number
of Russians, a certain num-
ber of Frenchmen, a certain
number of something else -
and maybe five Americans
will go and the names of all
will come back and be card-
ed and be recorded. We
would not do anything with'
them. But in any indication
of any security problem, we
would pass them to the FBI.
At that time, as a counter-
intelligence program, we
were vigorously looking to
see whether any foreign
countries had support or
manipulation of our antiwar
and various other dissident
movements. We concluded
after our investigations that
they did not. There wasn't
any substantial foreign
assistance coming to this.
But we did look into it to see
whether that was so or not.
Q: But is a mail cover a
possible subject for crimi-
nal prosecution?
A: I do not believe so.
And I do not believe that the
people who are involved
even in the opening will be
prosecuted.
Q: Is the maintenance of
files containing the names
of Americans illegal under
the mandate?
A: Well, some time ago -
for the last three years -
we have been cleansing
some of these records.
Some of our security files,
some of the other things
that had material in it that'
really should not have been'
in it. We obviously cannot
do that now, because the
investigations are under
way and we cannot be in the
position of destroying
potential evidence for these,
investigations. But I have
directed that this kind of
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years. After that, MCC can license
the results to anyone.
Said Inman: "Our job is to develop
the technology. How the companies
use it commercially is up to them.
There is certainly no guarantee that
all companies will profit equally."
No matter which companies even-
tually profit, however, much of the
credit must go to Inman, most ob-
servers said. Inman is said to have
shepherded many skittish companies
through the sometimes-traumatic ex-
perience of sharing technology with
their competitors, and was ultimate-
ly responsible for persuading them
to provide some of their more talent-
ed researchers.
Inman minimized such competi-
tive problems, but he acknowledged
that some companies were initially
afraid that participation in MCC
would lead to the loss of trade se-
crets. Moreover, he allowed that
some: firms "undoubtedly" offered
their best researchers financial in-
centives for not joining MCC.
"There is always a tendency to
send who's available, not who's
best," be said.
But Inman apparently solved that
problem by hiring officials who
were not employees at shareholder
firms. Six of MCC's seven project
directors were "outside hires," he
said, as are about 60 percent of MCC's
t88 researchers. In all, the company
has 269 employees.
"That was unexpected,", he said.
"At first, we expected that our talent
would come from the shareholder
companies."
Talented researchers from non-
shareholder companies gave Inman
leverage. Several of the sharehold-
ing companies were reported to have
expressed concern that those outside
hirings would dilute their influence
within MCC. Inman would not com-
ment directly, but noted that the
percentage of MCC employees from
shareholder companies has risen
during the last year.
Despite some fears to the contrary,
Inman said he had never encoun-
tered a situation in which an em-
ployee of a shareholding company
was poaching on a project in which j
that company was not involved.
price for joining MCC is too
high for companies to .torn lust to
j:ind out what the competition is up
to " said Inman who in addition to
his CIA work also served as-director
ofndthe National Security gencv.
"A if we did find someone collect-
ing information on a project that
they were not a party to, we'd send
them home immediately."
Inman has also been credited with
easing early concerns about possible
antitrust problems with MCC. In the
developmental stages, those worries
may have frightened away compa-
nies such as Westinghouse, Bur-
roughs and Xerox, according to some
observers. But Inman, through his
contacts in Washington, helped push
legislation that eliminated that
threat.
In spite of his successes so far,
Inman was cautious about the fate of
MCC. He noted that some of the lead-
ing companies in computer research
- most notably, IBM and AT&T -
have not joined MCC, apparently be-
cause . their research efforts could
profit little from information from
other companies. Too, he said, many
of MCC's projects could be risky.
"Sometimes I wonder if our goals
are too ambitious," he said. "In many
areas, we are trying to leapfrog out
into technologies that are decades
away. There will be failures.
"But I'm confident that we can
develop technology as good as the
Japanese and their Fifth Generation
project," he said, referring to the
Japanese computer-development
plan. "In something like this, you're
never as far along as you'd like to be,
but we're certainly ahead of where I
thought we'd be 15 -months ago."
Certainly, there is no disappoint-
ment among state officials and resi-
dents of Austin, a central Texas city
that 'is bracketed by the Colorado
River and a series of lakes known as
the Highlands. Gov. White is among
the many Texas officials who are
promoting Austin and the University
of Texas as a Southern alternative to
Stanford University and Silicon Val-
ley - Silicon Hills is the Texas catch-
word and MCC was the crown
jewel in that campaign.
Wilson, the governor's adviser,
said an economic survey done by
Texas Commerce Bancshares, a.
Houston bank-holding company, esti-
mated that MCC could directly create
as many as 10,000 new jobs in elec-
tronics in the Austin area with the
the only down note."
next seven years.
Lee Cooke, president of the Austin
Chamber of Commerce, said MCC al-
ready had begun to show the expect-
ed "magnet effect," drawing other
.high-technology firms and their em-
ployees into the area. The city's popu-
lation is now 400,000, Cooke said,
compared with 341,000 in 1980..Cooke
estimated that MCC's economic rip-
ple effect could reach $500 million.
Indeed, Austin's economic boom
has produced some unwanted side
effects.
"Real estate prices are soaring in
Austin," Inman said. "In fact, that's
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