CENTER LANE INTERVIEW SUMMARY CL-996/8210/08

• Document Type: CREST
• Collection: STARGATE
• Document Number (FOIA) /ESDN (CREST): CIA-RDP96-00788R001600160002-7
• Release Decision: RIPPUB
• Original Classification: S
• Document Page Count: 16
• Document Creation Date: November 4, 2016
• Document Release Date: May 17, 2000
• Sequence Number: 2
• Publication Date: March 1, 1983
• Content Type: SUMMARY

SG1A
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#66: This will be a CENTER LANE interview for 17 February
1983. The time is 0830 hours. Relax and concentrate
now, relax, relax, relax and focus your attention right
now on the building in the photograph I've shown you. As
you do move your awareness to the inside of the area you
know as the left wing of the building. Do this now.
08: Here there's a....a persistent impression of....of a
room of blueprints.
#66: Describe.
#08 They are related to some...to engineering to.a...,very
extensive blueprints, to industrial engineering... Many,
many, many people,... about forty involved in the...in
the studying of...a refinement of these plans. The
picture is long, long tables with extensive blueprints
with thirty, forty people are working ...during the a
cool down stage the, impression, the impression of a man,
definitely an engineer, bald, 5 - 5 feet - 4 inches/5
feet - 5 inches. He's wearing glasses, and mustache,
appear to be center of attention in this endeavor.
#66 His activity.
#08 Say again
#66: Report his activity.
#08 He's ahead of the of this group responsible for the, for
the plans. He's the program chief, if you wish.
#66: Holding your fix, holding your fix, orient this area
within the left wing.
#08: It's a top floor. Top floor is the a,... the.a ..the
lower floors are the individual offices of the smaller
group, responsible for working on other parts of the plan
addressing an individual problem.
#66: Holding on the top floor in this area, describe the
objects you have called blueprints.
#08: Blueprints with the lines and scales lows shafts,
joints...(mumble) (mumble), Hydraulics....
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rma
#66: These things you call blueprints, describe their physical
construction, the material.
#08: Ah, okay. Extremely long, I believe the distinct
impression is that very long, a drafting table, but in
length, is as much as 30 or 40 feet, with this plan
unfolding almost to the length of the table, so that...so
that a portion of the plan can be examined in a, within
the width of three feet, and for whatever length you
want. But then the plan unfolds physically in greater
widths.
#66: Okay, I'd like to interrupt for a moment and give you
some instructions and then have you reaccess the target.
Focus intently on this area and these, I assume you have
some drawing type thing you've discovered here, some
drawings of some kind. You've called them blueprints.
#08: Yes, blueprints plans.
#66: Now, the material on which these things are drawn--
#08: Paper, blue, bluish white paper.
#66: All right.
#08: Bluish ink.
#66: All right. Are there other--
#08: --lines with degrees of lines interrupted lines that
mechanical drawing of lines.
#66: Are there different colored lines?
#08: Dark blue and light blue, heavy lines and fine lines.
#66: Now, deeper and deeper, deeper beyond the actual drawings
to what the drawings depict.
#08: Industrial complex, factory, plant...
#66: All right. Moving now from the top floor of the left
wing, moving now from the top floor of the left wing,
continue to explore the left wing.
#08: The middle floor of the sub-offices are the a the smaller
groups. There's a storage area in the basement. There's
a tube of, tube of a container. I think the storage
area for the, for the plans used in that wing, is in
the...It's below the street level (mumble).
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#66: I have no further questions concerning the left wing of
the building in the photograph I've shown you. But I'd
like to give you a few minutes.
#08: No, I don't have anything more (mumble)
#66: Fine. Remember now the perceptions you've had and I'd
like to ask you now to draw those perceptions for me.
#08: All right.
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DRAWING EXPLANATION
#08: Okay, in Sketch #1 which is very simple, it is
entitled "overview of the building", simply an effort
to pinpoint the specific area of interest so I have
labeled, front of the building in the appropriate
section and the streets surrounding that area. I
didn't bother with what I call the right side, because
we've all ready done that and I pinpointed through an
arrow, the specific area of interest.
#08: In sketch #2 is simply a two dimensional sketch,
entitled "area of interest" and sub-divided into top
floor, mid-level area and the below street level
area. Top floor is where the 30 or 40 specialists or
engineers work on these huge blueprints that I've
described in the session. The middle level area are
the smaller groups with smaller offices comprised of 3
to 5 persons addressing specific problems that relate
to the overall blueprint. And level, the storage area
which is somewhat of a secure area, by the way, you
just don't come in and out there willy-nilly. There's
a guard system and there's identification system and
what have you. It's serves as blueprint storage area
in these cylinder type containers, cardboard
containers, that are stored in there. In dimension,
proportionately speaking, I've simply drawn two lines
that would indicate a general ratio of the area,
Okay. This is below the street level, in the cellar,
if you wish. Okay. Now, you have any questions on
that or anything about the blueprints that I may not
have said?
#66: Okay. You said that in the area where you saw these
blueprints, there were large tables?
#08: Yes, very long, long somewhat narrow tables that I
would describe them as about three, three and a half
feet wide, maybe 20, 30 feet in length with these
long, long blueprints laid out on the tables. The
blueprints were all, the portions that I saw were
about 3, 3 and a half feet wide, but they were folded,
in other words, you had another 3 or 3 and a half feet
above what was on the table and perhaps another 3, 3
and a half feet underneath. So we're talking about a
very huge thing, a very huge blueprint. That's the
best way I can describe it.
#66: Okay. You observed behavior or activity while you
were there.
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#08: The impression of the activity is that the man that
I've described was the over chief of the program,
addressing the, responsible for the overall workings
and of the entire program and the blueprints.
Problems are addressed in overall picture and yet
specific problems and areas within the blueprint are
the responsibility of small groups of persons that
work on those specific areas of the blueprint, go down
to the mid-level area of the building, work on the
blueprints and eventually, in another session, or also
through individual sessions with the chief amend the
overall blueprint, the used blueprint.
#66: Okay. They are changing or amending?
#08: Yea.
#66: Now upstairs again, upper floor, how many people in
that general area?
#08: Well, it's--
#66: --One people?
#08: No, no, no, you know, I can say there are ten people.
That's only partially true, there are ten people at a
time that are responsible for that particular area,
but all of these other mid-level, other people working
in the mid-level area numbers as many as 30 to 40.
What I saw was in the top level, at the time that I
was seeing it, this conglomerate of 30 or 40 people
working on the overall blueprint. With the results of
their work on the specific portions of the blueprint
and receiving assignments, further assignments to
resolve other issues on the blueprint. After receipt
of these assignments, they go back to the mid-level
area and work on those particular problems that They
have been assigned to.
#66: Okay. In reference to the actual behavior or physical
doing, that was done in this upstairs area, what did
persons do?
#08: Make entries and amendments to the overall blueprint,
which is the result of the work of individual groups
working on specific portions of the blueprint.
#66: Okay, good.
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#08: Okay, sketch #3 is an attempt to give an impression of
the blueprint table as it appears and to further
define. It's a drafting type table with a perceived
green top about 30 foot in length and about 3 to 3 and
a half feet wide. The blueprint is in reality equal
to or bigger than the table, in both length and
width. I don't know the length and in width it is
folded in three, is overlapped and underlapped,
really. So that what is perceived on the table is on
third of the blueprint, either the top third, middle
third or the lower third. The entire blueprint be
estimated, I would assume, would be about 6 feet, but
I have no feeling for the actual real dimensions, It
could be 7 feet, 8 feet, 9 feet, just simply know that
what is studied on the table is just approximately 1/3
of the blueprint. And if attention is focused on the,
say, the top portion of the blueprint, then you have
to fold the blueprint, turn it over and put on the
table. If you want the middle section, then you would
fold the blueprint underneath and have the top section
and the lower section folded upon itself so that the
middle section would be perceived. Now as to contents
of the blueprint, I can not draw that. I can describe
it. It's grayish white paper with heavy blue lines
with degrees, with cylinders. It's a mechanical type
drawing, type blueprint with heavy lines interrupted
lines with degrees and symbols that I do not
understand. There are fine lines and there are
heavier lines, depending on what pen or whatever ink
or whatever was used. But it gave me the impression
of hydraulics and mechanical engineering. There are
joints, there are representations of steel,
again,steel joints and long rods and cylinders and
hydraulics and this type of thing and it's just much
to complicated for my head. But that's the feeling,
the impression that I received about the contents of
the drawing. Is there anything else I can add like
shed more light?
#66: No, Okay, that's fine. Is there anything else you
like to add?
#08: No.
#66: Okay, good.
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NAME OF SUBJECT CIO TITLE (IF INCIDENT - C+!eTt SVItMi1TED
SG1A
CL-996/8210/08
SG1A
On 17 F Source CL-08 was interviewed
concerning "OWN During a previous interview
(CL-989/8210 08, conducted 6 January 1983) Source was unable
to describe one section of a building which Source called the
"Left Wing" of the building. This interview was an attempt
to have Source describe this section. Source stated
substantially as follows:
On the top floor of the left wing of the building was a
room with drafting tables 20 to 40 feet long. On the tables
were blueprint plans. Source described the blueprint plans
as being almost as long as the drafting tables and up to 10
feet wide. The plans were folded into approximately three
foot Bide sections sections so that they could be examined on
the tables. The blueprint plans were bluish white paper with
heavy and fine lines of dark and light blue. The heavy lines
were interrupted lines and were marked with degrees and other
symbols that Source did not understand. Source further
described the plans as being mechanical drawings related to
industrial engineering. Source believed the drawings to be
of an industrial complex, a factory or plant. These drawings
represented steel joints, long rods, cylinders, and
hydraulics; all of which was too complicated for Source to
understand.
The middle floors of the left wing of the building were
individual offices. in these small offices work was done on
specific problems that related to the blueprint plans on the
top floor.
Below street level was a blueprint storage area. Here
there were cylinder type cardboard storage containers. This
was a secure area with a guard system and an identification
system.
Personnel activity within the left wing of the building
was focused around the work on the blueprint plans on the top
WARNING NOTICE: SENSITIVE CLASSIFIED BY: MSG, DAMI-ISH
INTELLIGENCE SOURCES AND DTG: 051630ZJUL78
METHODS INVOLVED DECL: Originating Agency's
NOT REALEASABLE TO FOREIGN Determination Required
NATIONALS
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AGENT REPORT
For use of this fcrrn, set, FM 30.17([); AR 381-13(i; the proponent atjet:cy is the otfec
SG1A
CL-996/8210/08
floor. On the top floor approximately 30 to 40 specialists/engineers
worked on these blueprints. In the middle level smaller offices,
groups of three to five personnel addressed specific problems (not
further identified) that related to the overall blueprint. Personnel,
on the top floor made entries and amendments (not further identified)
working on specific portions of the blueprint.
The man responsible for the blueprint plans, the "program chief"
(not further identified) on the top floor, was an engineer. Source
described this man as follows:
514" - 515" tall
Bald with a mustache
Wore glasses
This man appeared to be the center of attention for all that happened
concerning the blueprint plans.
No further amplifying information was obtained from Source during
this interview.
Attached hereto is EXHIBIT I, drawings provided by Source
concerning the areas described above.
AGENT"S NOTES: After the completion of the interview,xource
spontaneously volunteered that the "program chief's" name might be
Molinikov (phonetic).
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US ARMY
INTELLIGENCE AND SECURITY
COMMAND
EXHIBIT
COVER SHEET
SG1A
1 .ia:, 78)
SUBJECT:
FILE NUMBER: CL-996/8210/08
PREPARING UNIT:
AGENT REPORT DATED:
DESCRIPTION : Drawings
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