VISIT OF INGO SWANN TO AMSAA, 17 OCTOBER 1978

• Document Type: CREST
• Collection: STARGATE
• Document Number (FOIA) /ESDN (CREST): CIA-RDP96-00788R001200240010-3
• Release Decision: RIFPUB
• Original Classification: S
• Document Page Count: 4
• Document Creation Date: November 4, 2016
• Document Release Date: June 19, 1998
• Sequence Number: 10
• Publication Date: October 30, 1978
• Content Type: MFR

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DRXSY-DS
MEMORANDUM FOR RECORD:
SUBJECT: Visit of Ingo Swann to AMSAA, 17 October 1978
30 October 1978
1. .(S-ORCON) At the request of AMSAA's Grill Flame participants, Ingo Swann
graciously agreed to spend a day at AMSAA to share his remote viewing experi-
ences and perceptions with us as well as to discuss the perceptions, ideas,
and frustrations evolved from our limited remote viewing experiences of Grill
Flame.
2. (S-ORCON) Prior to his visit, the undersigned and Ingo had agreed that he
would not be asked to participate in any experiments. Thus, the day was spent
on discussions, with the following people present throughout the day:
Dr. Sperrazza
John Kramar
Lynne Taylor
Scott Phillips
Paul Kunselman
Ray Dietz
Anthony Murdock
Harris Walker
The major points of the discussions are summarized in the following
paragraphs.
3. (S-ORCON) Rise Time. The concept of rise time is critical to the success
of any remote viewing session. Rise time is best described as follows: a
subject is told that he will be participating in a remote viewing session
two days from now at 1300 hours. During these next two days, the subject
prepares himself for the session, knowing precisely that his time of heightened
awareness will occur at 1300 hours on the scheduled day. Thus, it is absolutely
essential that the session take place at 1300 hours; not 1305 hours, but only
809759
CLASSIFIED BY: MSG, 7 JUL 78, DA
(DAMA-ISH), WASH, DC
EXEMPTED FROM GENE-RA DECLASSIFICATION
SCHEDULE OF EXECUTIVE ORDER 11652
EXEMPTION CATEGORY: 2
DECLASSIFY ON: 31 D!2008
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DRXSY-DS 30 October 1978
SUBJECT:. Visit of Ingo Swann to AMSAA, 17 October 1978 (U)
1300 hours. If a session is-held on time, a subject's rise time tends to stay
high for several minutes and then gradually starts to taper off. However, if
a session is delayed, a subject's rise time drops dramatically after the sched-
uled time has passed, noticeably affecting the amount and reliability of the
information he perceives. Ingo stated that he will not run a session if it
does not start precisely at the appointed time. Our limited experience of
Grill Flame tends to confirm this concept. (It is also interesting to note
that the concept of rise time is equally applicable to the inbound experimenter
(interviewer)).
4. (S-ORCON) Interviewer/Subject Relationship. The interviewer/subject
relationship is the most important aspect of remote viewing. This is a
special relationship that develops over time, based on training, experience,
and the personalities of the individuals involved. This relationship is
dependent on numerous factors, detailed below, and the interaction of these
factors determines the outcome of each and every session.
a. First and foremost, this is a relationship between people. While
they don't have to be the best of friends, they must respect each other
and be able to communicate with each other in order to establish the rapport
that works best for them.
b. Both the interviewer and the subject have to have a positive outlook
about remote viewing and maintain a success oriented rapport.
c. The interviewer must be sensitive to what the subject says during a
session and, more importantly, to what he says to the subject.
(1) The vocabulary of the interviewer should not include negative words
or words which cue the subject or reinforce his specific statements. For
example, words such as "not," "miss," "trial," "experiment," or "interrogate"
should not be used. Ingo insists that his interviewer use only certain words
and ask questions which do not contain an object. However, that is peculiar
to Ingo. He is, however, in the midst of researching the effects of the inter-
viewer's vocabulary.
(2) The findings of remote-viewing sessions conducted to date indicate
that a subject's basic perceptions of form, shape, light versus dark, etc
tend to be correct; however, when a subject defines a function or specific
details, these impressions are most often incorrect. These interpretations
(signal to noise ratio) are broken into three categories:
analytic overlay
memory overlay
visual overlay
2
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DRXSY-DS 30 October 1978
SUBJECT: Visit of Ingo Swann to AMSAA, 17 October 1978 (U)
For example, if a subject says he sees a bridge, the interviewer must be
careful not to reinforce the concept of bridge, but rather query the subject
to find out what original image was overlayed to become a bridge, i.e., a
feeling of lots of metal. The feeling-of metal is significant; the bridge
may or may not be correct.
(3) The interviewer has to learn to keep his mouth shut!
d. The subject must be allowed to develop his individual style of remote
viewing. Some subjects close their eyes, some prefer the lights to be out,
etc.
e. "Quiet time," the 5-15 minutes prior to the start of a session, is
important to both the subject and the interviewer. Ingo has found this to
be a necessary requirement for himself and the subjects he is currently
training. Our Grill Flame sessions confirm this concept also, again remembering
that each subject and interviewer has their own particular way of "quieting"
down.
5. (S-ORCON) Feedback. Feedback should be instant, if possible, or, at minimum,
provided as soon as possible. The type of feedback provided depends on the type
of remote viewing session being conducted; however, Ingo was adamant on the fact
that a subject should be told he's correct if he is (in those situations where
the interviewer knows the details of the target) and not pressured into detail
overlay.
6. (S-ORCON) Outbound Experimenter Behavior. The researchers at SRI and Ingo
feel that the outbound experimenter does not influence subject responses. How-
ever, Ingo's experience in remote viewing sessions using outbound experimenters
is quite limited. The Grill Flame participants feel the outbounder plays a more
important role than either Ingo or SRI assign to him.
7. (S-ORLON) Atmosphere. Ingo reinforced the fact that the atmosphere in which
a remote viewing session is held i.s important. Sessions should preferably be
held in one designated room. The room should be comfortable and away from out-
side interruptions. Basically, the room should be conducive to successful
sessions.
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DRXSY-DS 30 October 1978
SUBJECT: Visit of Ingo Swann to AMSAA, 17 October 1978 (U)
8. (S-ORCON) The Grill Flame participants appreciated Ingo's visit to AMSAA.
Besides being interesting and informative, it helps to know that your own
doubts and perceptions are shared by someone whose experience encompasses
several years of intense effort.
LYNNE S. TAYLOR
Copies furnished:
Dr.
Sperrazza
Mr.
J.
Kramar
Mr.
S.
Phillips
Mr.
M.
Reches
Mr.
C.
Thomas
Mr.
P.
Kunselman
Mr.
R.
Dietz
Mr.
A.
Murdock
Mr.
G.
Hanna
Dr.
E.
Walker, BRL
Dr.
H.
Puthoff, SRI
Mr.
R.
Targ, SRI
,4.
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