ADMIRAL TURNER S SPEECH FILES INTERVIEW WITH MR. TED HOLMBERG

• Document Type: CREST
• Collection: General CIA Records
• Document Number (FOIA) /ESDN (CREST): CIA-RDP80B01554R003600020001-4
• Release Decision: RIFPUB
• Original Classification: K
• Document Page Count: 86
• Document Creation Date: December 14, 2016
• Document Release Date: February 20, 2003
• Sequence Number: 1
• Publication Date: May 18, 1973
• Content Type: SPEECH

ADMIRAL TURNER'S SPEECH FILES
18 MAY 1973
INTERVIEW WITH MR. TED HOLMBERG
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ILLINOIS
Proud middle America background
Started collegiate education
New England - Annapolis
Lined mainly both coasts
Think of self as cross pollenization
1
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CAREER
Pearl Harbor
Naval Academy
Did not decide on career many years
Tempted to get out
1955 turned down good offer
Back to sea
More exciting.- challenging ever since
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 SUCCESS
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Whatever small success
Example Parents
Read lot
Interested
Open minded
Education
Amherst - Oxford liberal arts emphasis on
thinking-- reasoning, not factual absorption
Annapolis - rigor - logic of engineering & science
Advice
Get good education - explore ideas not facts
Don't let yourself become narrow
Always look your job - viewpoint
Your superiors - what his problems
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o etter fob
More interesting (Too many people don't see by picture)
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ROUTINE
8:00 - 5:30/6:00
1. Meet with people
2. Attend classes
3. Clear out paper
Athletics
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HOMEWORK
2 - 3 Hours
Thinking - reading - writing
Aviod interruptions
5
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DOUBTS
Had doubts all year
Only recent weeks truly confident - seen come together
Man who looks ahead to next job and-has no doubts -
has passed his peak
Considerable faith - abilities
God,-- given - need not be placed over head
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1. Encourage subordinates be frank
Create atmosphere
Show pays off
Listen - act
2. Consciously bring people do not think alike
Civilian advisors
Consultants
3. Get out talk to people
Ships
Midshipmen
Campus
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GROW
3 Newspapers
Providence Journal
Newport
Christian Science Monitor
plus New York Times - Sunday
Journals - world affairs
Seek out intellectual conversation
No person meet from whom can no learn something
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READING
Books - international and military affairs
War and Politics
Best and the Brightest
Like keep novel going
Hornblower
August 1914
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RELAX
Squash
Tennis
Walk
Dog
Reading
Travel
Paint?
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PROFESSION
Member Congress
Diplomat
Prejudice for Federal Government
Fascination
Sense contribution
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MEASURES OF SUCCESS
1. Most importantly to people -
Encourage live more to fulfill capabilities
Why like present job
2. Contribution to larger causes
Strengthening society
More people this country & round world have advantages
I have had
Better read - more rounded person
PhD
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Large measure due VN
Changes attitudes, mores, educational level youth of country
Large organizations slow to adapt
Why changes Z so essential
With AVF even more critical be up with times
Confident can rise up from nadir public support
1. Is important have a capable military
People recognize
2. Exciting challenging profession
Continue improve Profession
Improve ability explain why needed
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1. Continued value attack carrier
Beginning
End
2. Importance and versatility of NGFS
3. Most -
Need flexibility
Performed lot roles not anticipated
Must not become stereotyped
Doctrine and forces
adaptable - multi-purpose
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STRATEGIC THINKING
Recognize must be prepared for all sorts eventualities
Even more Korea - VN
Contrast standard image of replay WW II
Stress importance using military force to deter conflicts as well
be prepared fight if necessary
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Lippman - good generalization
we are maritime power
Pres Nixon has stressed his speaches
Same time many legitimate objectives can not be accomplished
by sea and air forces along
Individual case-by-case decision
Easy indulge hindshight in particular instances
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History good instructor - not repeat itself -
Major difference - communication
Before French Revolution - mercenaries could fight -
no one know
Don't believe if had fought VN all volunteers - country disinterested
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 NAVY IN LIMITED WARS
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No way US- be involved limited war (Canada-Mexico) without
needing sea lanes -
Primary task ensure can get wherever need to go
Beyond that - best way keep war limited -
minimize involvement - especially on other fellow's territory
Why Naval air power or blockade so useful -
If decide insert troops
Marines have advantage over beach
extraction
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BB
Gorskov not think carrier dead -
Way use carriers changing
Still essential control of seas
Submarines - great future
Not dominate some time -
1. Threat to shipping from air & subs -
2. Trained in lone wolf - stealth operations
Need develop techniques
Team operations
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Bi-polar - greater emphasis on readiness for big war
Multi-polar - premium on flexibility of military forces
for unexpected
Multi-increased use of Navy as arm of diplomacy
Nations more likely shift
their alignment on issues
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No- England's separation from continent of
20 miles in 18th - 19th - greater than ours of 3,000 today
Age of missiles and Nuclear weapons -
never remote from battlefields as was England
Age delicate balancing of economic,
diplomatic and military power, never can be
indifferent to fate of an ally.
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No - Reenlistment rates are up markedly -
Congress has improved pay
Z has improved conditions
life
Job market not as good
Tempo of overseas operations
Must keep working - AVF - intend to do so
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NOT SO - CAN TAKE YOU JUST A FEW MILES TO NEW EM HOUSING AS NICE AS
ANY OFFICERS. AND MORE UNITS AVAILABLE EVERY YEAR. NAVY PUSHED HARD
LAST 4 YEARS FOR MORE AND BETTER HOUSING.
HOUSING ALLOWANCE NOT ADEQUATE FOR THOSE CAN NOT LIVE IN GOVERNMENT
HOUSING - CONGRESS DID INCREASE IT NOT LONG AGO.
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NOT DISCOURAGING - 15 TANTALIZING -
MOST NAVY MEN UNDERSTAND REASON
LEGAL OILING NUMBER MEN EACH GRADE
AS ONE LEAVES/PROMOTED - OPENING
IF NO ONE WAITING IN LINE, OPPORTUNITY GOES VACANT AND PAY LOST
WHY HAVE QUAL EXAMS 2 YEAR - LAST MAN CAN WAIT 6 MO
BUT RECENTLY SHORTAGES PERSONNEL FUNDS
FORCED LONGER WAITING LEST TO SAVE $
ADDITION - PROUD OF OUR SYSTEM - NO CHANCE - FAIR AND OBJECTIVE
EM NAVY WIDE TEST
OFFICERS - STATUTORY BOARD
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 CIVILIAN PARTICIPATION
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DEFINITELY NO -
EVEN AVF CONSIDERABLE NUMBER CIVILIANS COMING AND GOING
ONLY WANT ABOUT 30% REENLISTMENT
PYRAMID
SELECTIVITY
DO NEED ENSURE DRAWING ALL SECTORS COUNTRY - GEOGRAPHICALLY,
ECONOMICALLY, SOCIALLY, ETHNICALLY, ETC. NEED BE CONSCIOUS IN
RECRUITING
ALSO NEED BE CONSCIOUS IMPORTANCE MAINTAINING DIALOGUE
CIVILIAN WORLD.
TWO WAY STREET -
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EMPHATICALLY NO - WE HAVE MADE EFFORTS OVER 20 YEARS OPEN
OPPORTUNITIES MINORITIES.
REMEMBER INCIDENT 1951
MISSED WHOLE ISLAND
NAVY IS BEHIND IN #'S - WORKING TO CORRECT
MEANTIME - PERCEIVED RACISM
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 COMMUNITIES
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FEEL VERY REAL RESPONSIBILITIES
RECEIVE WONDERFUL SUPPORT - ESPECIALLY NEWPORT
WORK HARD AT COOPERATION AND COMMUNITY RELATIONS - CHURCH,
SCOUTING, LITTLE LEAGUE, BOY'S CLUB, PTA, ETC.
STILL, OUR MISSION IS TO PROVIDE MOST DEFENSE FOR TAX PAYER'S DOLLAR.
CAN NOT JUSTIFY EXPENDITURES FOR REASONS OF BOLSTERING THE ECONOMY,
OTHER AS DIRECTED BY CIVILIAN AUTHORITIES
YOU CAN APPRECIATE HOW EXPENSIVE AND DESTORTED OUR MILITARY
ESTABLISHMENT COULD BE IF NEVER COULD CHANGE.
PREDICT IMPACT ON NEWPORT SUBSTANTIALLY LESS THAN FORECAST
MANY PEOPLE LEAVING SPEND LESS 37% INCOME IN R.I.
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Theoretically some savings might be possible
But expense in long run great
Country built on responsiveness of government to citizens
Soviet Union government can align bases without
political factors - but I would not trade
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In democratic government never want one element predominate
more appropriate
Eisenhower was warning against lack alertness
to this in 1 area
Fact you asked? indicates is a balancing -
I think reasonable
Navy recently struck some hard bargains - 2 giants
Litton - Grumman
Some measure coop essential to security -
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MID CAREER OFFICERS - EXPAND HORIZONS
COME TO US TECHNICAL BACKGROUND EXPERIENCE, TRAINING, EDUCATION
BLACK & WHITE
PREPARE FOR BROADER PROBLEMS LIE AHEAD - UNCERTAIN, INEACT
ONE WAY LOOK -
HAVE BEEN ANSWERING?
NOW ASK - IS RIGHT?
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 SCHOOL VS SHIP
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NO - JUST DIFFERENT
BEAUTY NAVY CAREER IS VARIETY EXPERIENCES
MAKES LIFE INTELLECTUALLY VITAL
2 1/2 YRS CTG - MED
FLEW
HELO - SURPRISE INSPECTIONS
TRIED IMAGINE SOV ADM THINKING DEALT MEN ACTION
IN BETWEEN
ANALYZED DECISIONS INVOLVING $
DEALT MEN KEEN MANGES/POL
DELV4*04&gPoPAAWRiW20('J~ IA--RbPtt6BM4kgO3 A b(f -4PROME SS
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BEAUTIFULLY -
ENTHUSIASM
REASONABLE ATTENDANCE
WIVES DID WELL -
GREAT ? IMAGINATION
DEMAND NEXT YEAR
WORTHWHILE - KEEP HUSBAND AND WIFE TEAM CLOSE
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Growing - only waiting constitutional amendment
Part effort take every reasonable step meet manpower
requirements in AVF.
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lst - Don't think our people as isolated as suggest
Stressed need appreciate importance understanding national will -
Opinion
Servants
Major conference with media
Race relations *raining
Contemporary Civilization
Art
Movie
Biology
China
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YES - IMAGE MILITARY CREATES IS INCREASINGLY IMPORTANT AS ACCENT
MISSION OF DETERRING -
SAME TIME CAN'T DO JOB WITH MCRRORS OR MADISON AVE TECHNIQUES
POTEMKIN VILLAGE - SEEN THROUGH
STILL - MUST LEARN TO CONSIDER IMPACT IMAGE
SMALL AND LARGE SHOW OF FORCE
MUST ALSO CONSIDER IMPACT STATEMENTS OPINIONS POTENTIAL ADVERSARIES
AND 3RD NATIONS
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WAR INVOLVES KILLING
KILLING IMMORAL
WAR IMMORAL
WHAT PEOPLE MEAN IS MDRE OR LESS MORAL - JUST USE OF
MORALITY CONFUSES ISSUE - MAKES IT APPEAR BLACK AND WHILE STANDARD
EXISTS -
INSTEAD MUST LOOK AT LEACH ACTION - STEP LEAD TO WAR - BEST
CAN DO UNDER CIRCUMSTANCES.
POLICEMAN KILLS ASSAILANT JUST BEFORE MURDER - COMMITING LEAST
IMMORAL ACT UNDER CIRCUMSTANCES
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Consequences to those and other thousands be as bas or worse
if plan not exist
Undoubtedly have plans
Nuclear war -
Existence of plans & capability what deters
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UNLAWFUL
Steal, murder, lie, cheat
Standards decency - morality
Individual issue -
Consequences worth it
Nelson's blind eye
events overtaken orders -
Rowan
Burke
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Apathy
Strength will intelligence do whatever necessary -
Our way government and principles freedom individual root
source that strength
But - participation by people is basic foundation
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J
ScyllRr and Charybdis -
Schyll of pricing ourselves out
the requisite capability
Charybdis of not being able to afford what modern
technology demands as minimum capabilities
People - over extended
Can't replay VN without greater resources
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Believe well aware need
human relations
Stress - decision no good if ...
Remember - education - not training
Not "how to do it" all -
Take forever -
Make conscious need and how to approach
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SURFACE ENGAGEMENTS
Yes - remotely
Soviets building 2 carriers
In time - considerable -
possible
Nature Warfare changing
Longer range
quicker
more electronic impact
more difficult to hide/deceive
Easier predict outcome -
therefore less likely happen
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 16 May
From: 003
To: 00
Subj: interview with Holmberg
'1. Ted was kind enough to give me a copy
of the questions he would like to ask you.
You should read through them first -- then
we should talk about them before I try to
write up suggested answers to those that I
can answer.
2. Ted was explicit AS I AM -- keep the
answers short, precise. We will have com-
plete flexibility to cover what we want
and can stop the recorder, sift out an
answer and then start the recorder again.
He does not repeat not intend to put you
on the spot. Any question that is un-
comfortable can be scrthched. You will
note the questions are good, pertinent
and not tied to any perishable, emotional
issue. You can see by the structure of
the questions that this will not be a
normal hardnews press conference.
3. I think it will be an excellent oppor-
tunity.
l~
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Keep answers short
Be specific, precise.
Avoid generalization
Anecdotes when possible.
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Let's begin at the beginning. You grew up in Illinois. Do you
think of yourself as pretty much a middle American?
What made you, a middle Westerner, decide on a career in the Navy?
Do you remember when the decision was made?
**
You have been enormously suucesful. To what do you attribute your
success? What advice would you give a young man entering the Navy now?
How do you epend an average day?
How much work do you take home?
**
You seem a man very sure of himself and of his place in the world.
you have any doubts? What are they?
As a man in great power, how do you.avoid becoming isolated?
**
How do you manage to stay on top of what's happening in the world,
to grow?
**
What do you read?
88
How do you relax?
If you were not an admiral of the Navy, what do you think you might be?
**
When the time comes to retire, how will you measure your career? By what
standards will you say it was a good and fruitful life? What have you not
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done in terms of hopes and dreams that you would try or 1 given 2nd chance
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Let's talk about the military if we may. It seems to have a bad
name in some quarters - especially among our young - Is this all
the fault of Vietnam? What can be done about it?
**
What did the Navy learn from Vietnam?
How has the strategic or tactical'thinking changed?*
**
There was some. feeling throughout. the Vietnam conflict.that our
nation's interests would have been better served by a very limited
land engagement with strong air and naval support. I believe it was
Walter Lippman who suggested that between either China and Russia'
and this country it was a question of an elephant against a whale
and we ought not to be drawn into an arena that would favor our
opposition. Have-you -anyntxx thoughts on this?
**
It has also been suggested in the aftermath of Vietnam that this
nation must recognize the fact that we may have passed through the
age of national wars that began with the French Revolution and may
now be returning to a time when limited wars are fought by jrofessional
military forces for very limited objectives without involving the
honor or emotional commitment of the beligerents involved? Is this a
possibility?
In such an era of limited wars, what would be the part played by the Navy?
**
The day of the big battleship is over. There are those who say the day of
the big airplane carrier is dead Too.. Is the Navy of the future to be a
submarine oriented force for attack with missiles?
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Do you think it is even remotely possible that we will ever again
see a surface naval engagement of the magnitude of say Midway? What
form would it take?
**
The domination of the period since World War II by only two world
powers will probably prove a temporary aberration. How will the change
from a bi-polar to a multi-polar world change Navy thinking?
Does a maritme orientation towards strategy open us to the same
criticism as England was subject to in past centuries from Europe -
that there was a lack of commitment to allies?
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Let's talk about the Navy and Newport and some more @bread and butter
matters if we may?
Is the rate of loss of enlisted men and officers still as high as it'
was a fews years ago?
**
Housing in,on everyone's mind. I've heard that enlisted men's quarters
are still very grim indeed. And that housing allowance comes nowhere
near covering costs of living in civilian housing. So?
**
Advancement in the navy is supposedly a chancy thing. I've heard that
ofetn a man received word that he-will be rated and then qq has to
wait six or more months to receive the rate. Isn't this a discouraging
atmosphere in which to plan a career?
**
Do you see a danger in a largely 9V volunteer service which would be
free of the pressures which civilian participation provides?
Is ra,~ism, becuaese of what seems a tradition of having black or
non-white stewards and other such practices, more of a problem in the
Navy than say in the Army or Air Force? And does it call for special
**
What kind of moral responsibility do you think the Navy has towards
the communities in which it lives? Toward Newport, for instance.
**
How much do you think political factors should affect the location
of bases? How much could be saved if there was no influence at all?
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There seems to be a tie-in between the military and industry in
many ways. What President Eisenhower called the military-industry
complex, I guess. How do you feel about it and especially about what
seems to be a tendency on the part of the Pentagon to substdite some
industries and a tendency of many high-ranking officers to join various
industries connected with military production when they retre?
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Just what is the War college supposed to do for the Navy?
Running a college is far different from running a ship. Is one
more demanding and challenging than the other?
**
You inaugurated a distaff course. on strategy and on anthropology
at the college for wives. How has it workrd?
88
While we're at it, what about the female part in the Navy of
the future?
**
I note in one of your speeches that you say one of the purposes
of the War College is to prepare the next crop of Naval leadership
To understand the society they serve and to deal intelligently
with the imprecise, uncertain and subjective character of the
national will. Yet I also note from the course of studies that there
os almost nothing that would help an officer, presumably isolated
from very much civilian contact, to truly understand the people he
is serving?
**
Has any thought been given to work in human as well as public
relations?
**
Is there any relationship here between this and the shift from
a national policy of containment to one of balance or influence.
Isn't the later to a great extent one of image and thus a ]ublic
relations problem? I'm think eslecially of such things as the British
navy of old and its image of invulnerability and the Roosevelt white
fleet, which first expressed this country's global interets
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What thoughts do you have about the morality of war?
How would you justify in your own mind plans which might kill
thousands of persons?
**
At what point is it justifyable for a military man to disobey
the orders of his superiors?
What do you see as the greatest danger to our nation?
To the navy?
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 Approved For Release 2003/04/18 : CIA-RDP80B01554R003600020001-4
Yes - remotely
Soviets building 2 carriers
In time - considerable -
possible-- -
Nature warfare changing
Longer range
quicker
more electronic impact
more difficult to hide/deceive.
Easier predict outcome -
therefore less likely happen
Bi-polar - greater emphasis on readiness for big war
Multi-polar - premium on flexibility of military forces
for unexpected
Multi-increased use of Navy as arm of diplomacy
Nations more likely shift
their alignment on issues
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 Appro qr se 0Wj4/11$s CIA-RDP80BO1554R003600020001-4
No- England's separation from continent of
20 miles in 18th - 19th - greater than ours of 3,000 today
Age of missiles and Nuclear weapons -
never remote from battlefields as was England
Age delicate balancing of economic,
diplomatic and military power, never can be
indifferent to fate of an ally.
RETENTION
No - Reenlistment rates are up markedly -
Congress has improved pay
Z has improved conditions
life
Job market not as good
Tempo of overseas operations
Must keep working - AVF - intend to do so
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 Approved For Release 2003/04/18 : CIA-RDP80BO1554R003600020001-4
HOUSING
NOT SO - CAN TAKE YOU JUST A. FEW MILES TO NEW EM HOUSING AS NICE AS
ANY OFFICERS. AND MORE UNITS AVAILABLE EVERY YEAR. NAVY PUSHED HARD
LAST 4 YEARS FOR MORE AND BETTER HOUSING.
HOUSING ALLOWANCE NOT ADEQUATE FOR THOSE CAN NOT LIVE IN GOVERNMENT
HOUSING - CONGRESS DID INCREASE IT NOT LONG AGO.
ADVANCEMENT
NOT DISCOURAGING - IS TANTALIZING -
MOST NAVY MEN UNDERSTAND REASON
LEGAL OILING NUMBER MEN EACH GRADE
AS ONE LEAVES/PROMOTED - OPENING
IF NO ONE WAITING IN LINE, OPPORTUNITY GOES VACANT AND PAY LOST
WHY HAVE QUAL EXAMS 2 YEAR - LAST MAN CAN WAIT 6 MO
BUT RECENTLY SHORTAGES PERSONNEL FUNDS
FORCED LONGER WAITING LEST TO SAVE $
ADDITION - PROUD OF OUR SYSTEM - NO CHANCE - FAIR AND OBJECTIVE
E'i NAVY WIDE TEST
OFFICERS .- STATUTORY BOARD
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 Approved For fZ e"~~ OR O ~8 cI, IR 80B01554R003600020001-4
DEFINITELY NO -
EVEN AVF CONSIDERABLE NUMBER CIVILIANS COMING AND GOING
ONLY WANT ABOUT 30% REENLISTMENT
PYRAMID
SELECTIVITY
DO NEED ENSURE DRAWING ALL SECTORS COUNTRY GEOGRAPHICALLY,
ECONOMICALLY, SOCIALLY, ETHNICALLY, ETC. NEED BE CONSCIOUS IN
RECRUITING
ALSO NEED BE CONSCIOUS IMPORTANCE MAINTAINING DIALOGUE
CIVILIAN WORLD.
TWO WAY STREET -
AVF MEANS CIVILIANS MUST INCREASE NOT DECREASE INTEREST IN
EMPHATICALLY NO - WE HAVE MADE EFFORTS OVER 20 YEARS OPEN
OPPORTUNITIES MINORITIES.
REMEMBER INCIDENT 1951
MISSED WHOLE ISLAND
NAVY IS BEHIND IN tt'S - WORKING TO CORRECT
MEANTIME - PERCEIVED RACISM
26
i
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 Approved For Releasee "AiLE331 -RDP80B01554R003600020001-4
FEEL VERY REAL RESPONSIBILITIES
RECEIVE WONDERFUL SUPPORT - ESPECIALLY NEWPORT
WORK HARD AT COOPERATION AND COMMUNITY RELATIONS - CHURCH,
SCOUTING, LITTLE LEAGUE, BOY'S CLUB, PTA, ETC.
STILL, OUR MISSION IS TO PROVIDE MOST DEFENSE FOR TAX PAYER'S DOLLAR.
CAN NOT JUSTIFY EXPENDITURES FOR REASONS OF BOLSTERING THE ECONOMY,
OTHER AS DIRECTED BY CIVILIAN AUTHORITIES
YOU CAN APPRECIATE HOW EXPENSIVE AND DESTORTED OUR MILITARY
ESTABLISHMENT COULD BE IF NEVER COULD CHANGE.
PREDICT IMPACT ON NEWPORT SUBSTANTIALLY LESS THAN FORECAST
MANY PEOPLE LEAVING SPEND LESS 37% INCOME IN R.I.
POLITICAL FACTORS
Theoretically some savings might be possible
But expense in long run great
Country built on responsiveness of government to citizens
Soviet Union government can align bases without
political factors - but I would not trade
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 In democratic government never want one element predominate
more appropriate
Eisenhower was warning against lack alertness
to this in 1 area
Fact you asked? indicates is a balancing -
I think reasonable
Navy recently struck some hard bargains - 2 giants
Litton - Grumman
Some measure coop essential to security -
Build house - work architect & builder -
MID CAREER OFFICERS - EXPAND HORIZONS
COME TO US TECHNICAL BACKGROUND EXPERIENCE, TRAINING, EDUCATION
BLACK & WHITE
PREPARE FOR BROADER PROBLEMS LIE AHEAD - UNCERTAIN, INEACT
ONE WAY LOOK -
HAVE BEEN ANSWERING?
NOW ASK - IS RIGHT?
 Approved For Release 2003/04/18 : CIA-RDP80BO1554R003600020001-4
SCHOOL VS SHIP
NO - JUST DIFFERENT
BEAUTY NAVY CAREER IS VARIETY EXPERIENCES
MAKES LIFE INTELLECTUALLY VITAL
2 1/2 YRS CTG - MED
FLEW
HELO - SURPRISE INSPECTIONS
TRIED IMAGINE SOV ADM THINKING DEALT MEN ACTION
IN BETWEEN
ANALYZED DECISIONS INVOLVING $
DEALT MEN KEEN MANGES/POL
DELVING INTO HISTORY, PEDAGOGY - DEAL MEN OF ACADEMIC PROMESS
BEAUTIFULLY -
ENTHUSIASM
REASONABLE ATTENDANCE
WIVES DID WELL.
GREAT ? IMAGINATION
DEMAND NEXT YEAR
WORTHWHILE - KEEP HUSBAND AND WIFE TEAM CLOSE
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 FEMALE S
Growing - only waiting constitutional amendment
Part effort take every reasonable step meet manpower
requirements in AVF.
UNDERSTAND PEOPLE
1st Don't think our people as isolated as suggest
- C
Stressed need appreciate importance understanding national will -
Servants
Opinion
Major conference w,\7ith media
relations training
Contemporary civilization
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 Approved For Release 2003/04/18 : CIA-RDP80B01554R003600020001-4
_i RILA RELATIONS
Believe well aware need
human relations
Stress - decision no good if :..
-Remember --education ---not training
Not "how to do it" all -
Take forever -
Make conscious need and how to approach
YES - IMAGE MILITARY CREATES IS INCREASINGLY IMPORTANT AS ACCENT
MISSION OF DETERRING -
SAME TIME CAN'T DO JOB WITH MCRRORS OR MADISON AVE TECHNIQUES
POTEMKIN VILLAGE - SEEN THROUGH
STILL - MUST LEARN'TO CONSIDER IMPACT IMAGE -
SMALL AND LARGE SHOW OF FORCE
MUST ALSO CONSIDER IMPACT STATEMENTS OPINIONS POTENTIAL ADVERSARIES
AND 3RD NATIONS
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 Approved For Release 2WXUMS! CIA-RDP80BO1554R003600020001-4
WAR INVOLVES KILLING
KILLING IMMORAL
WAR IMMORAL
WHAT PEOPLE MEAN IS INDRE OR LESS MORAL - JUST. USE OF
MORALITY-CONFUSES-ISSUE - MAKES . IT. APPEAR BLACK AND WHILE..STANDARD
EXISTS -
INSTEAD MUST LOOK AT LEACH ACTION - STEP LEAD TO WAR - BEST
CAN DO UNDER CIRCUMSTANCES.
POLICEMAN KILLS ASSAILANT JUST BEFORE MURDER - COMMITING LEAST
IMMORAL ACT UNDER CIRCUMSTANCES
KITJL THOUSANDS
Consequences to those and other thousands be as bas or worse
if plan not exist
Undoubtedly have plans
Nuclear war -
Existence of plans & capability what deters
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 Approved For Release 2003/04/18 : CIA-RDP80B01554R003600020001-4
DISOBEY ORDERS
UMLAV FUL
Steal, murder, lie, cheat
Standards decency - morality
Individual issue -
Consequences worth it
Nelson's blind eye
events overtaken orders -
Rowan
Burke
GREATEST DANGER
Apathy
Strength will intelligence do whatever necessary -
Our way government and principles freedom individual root
source that strength
But - participation by people is basic foundation
41
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 Approved For Release 2003104/18 : CIA-RDP80BO1554R003600020001-4
NAVY THREAT
Scyll& and Charybdis
SchyllE~ of pricing ourselves out
the requisite capability
Charybdis of not being able to-afford what modern
technology demands as minimum capabilities
People - over extended
Can't replay VN without greater resources
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 Approved For Release!2003/a41i8 : CIA-RDP80BO1554R003600020001-4
Proud middle America background
S arted collegiate education
New England - Annapolis
Lined mainly both coasts
Think of self as cross pollenization
CAREER
Pearl Harbor
Naval Academy
Did not decide on career many years
Tempted to get out
1955 turned down good offer
Back to sea
More exciting - challenging ever since
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 pproved fo,r,RRlease 2003/04/18 : CIA-RDP80BO1554R003600020001-4
Example -Parents
Read lot
Interested
Open minded
Amherst - Oxford liberal arts emphasis on
thinking - reasoning, not factual absorption
Annapolis - rigor - logic of engineering & science
Advice
Get good education - explore ideas not facts
Don't let yourself become narrow
Always look your job - viewpoint
Your superiors - what his problems
Prepare yourself
Do better job
More interesting (Too many people don't see by picture)
ROUTINE.
8:00 - 5:30/6:00
1. Meet with people
2. Attend classes
3. Clear out paper
Athletics
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 Approved For Release 2003/04/18 : CIA-RDP80B01554R003600020001-4
HOMEWORK
2 - 3 Hours
Thinking - reading - writing
Aviod interruptions
DOUBTS
Had doubts all year
Only recent weeks truly confident - seen come together
Man who looks ahead to next job and-has no doubts
has passed his peak
Considerable faith - abilities
God - given - need not be placed over head
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 r SOLATzOI'r
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at t .
1. Encourage subordinates be frank
Create atmosphere
Show pays off
Listen act
2. Consciously bring people do not think alike
Civilian advisors
Consultants
3. Get out talk to people
Ships
Midshipmen
Campus
GROW
3 Newspapers
Providence Journal
Newport
Christian Science Monitor
plus New York Times - Sunday
Journals - world affairs
Seek out intellectual conversation
No person meet from whom can no learn something
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 Approved For Rele~s004/18 : CIA-RDP80B01554R003600020001-4
Books international and military affairs
War and Politics
Best and the Brightest
Like keep novel going
Hornblower
August 1914
Mystery
RELAX
Squash
Tennis
Walk
Dog
Reading
Travel
Paint?
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 Approved For Release 2003/04/18 : CIA-RDP80BO1554R003600020001-4
PROFESSION
Member Congress
Diplomat
Prejudice for Federal Government
Fascination
Sense contribution
11
MEASURES OF SUCCESS
Sense of contribution
1. Most importantly to people -
Encourage live more to fulfill capabilities
Why like present job
2. Contribution to larger causes
Strengthening society
More people this country & round world have advantages
I have had
Better read - more rounded person
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 ' J.l t LAR TY
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r>e - ure due Vi
Chances attitudes, mores, educational level youth of country
arse organizations slow to adapt
~:~= changes Z so essential
With AVF even more critical be up with times
Confident can rise up from nadir public support
1. Is important have a capable military
People recognize
2. Exciting challenging profession
Continue improve Profession
Improve ability explain why needed
VIETNAM LESSONS
Beginning
End
2. Importance and versatility of NGFS
3. Most -
Need flexibility
Performed lot roles not anticipated
Must not become stereotyped
Doctrine and forces
adaptable - multi-purpose
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 Approved For I8;RglkRDP80BO1554R003600020001-4
?ecc;:?ize must be prepared for all sorts eventualities
Even more Korea - VN
Contrast standard image of replay WW II
Stress importance using military force to deter conflicts as well
be prepared fight if necessary
VIETNAM STRATEGY
Lippman - good generalization
We are maritime power
Pres Nixon has stressed his speaches
Same time many legitimate objectives can not be accomplished
by sea and air forces along
Individual case-by-case decision
Easy indulge hindshight in particular instances
16
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 c 4C i 'REVOLUTION
Approved For a ease A-RDP80B01554R003600020001-4
History good instructor - not repeat itself -
Major difference - communication
Before French Revolution - mercenaries could fight -
no one know
Don't believe if had fought VN all volunteers - country disinterested
NAVY IN LIMITED WARS
No way US, be involved limited war (Canada-Mexico) without
needing sea lanes -
Primary task ensure can get wherever need to go
Beyond that - best way keep war limited
minimize involvement - especially on other fellow's territory
Why Naval air power or blockade so useful -
If decide insert troops
Marines have advantage over beach
extraction
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 Approved For Release 2003/04/18 : CIA-RDP80BO1554R003600020001-4
BB
Gorskov not think carrier dead -
Way use carriers changing
Still essential control of seas
Submarines - great future
Not dominate some time -
1. Threat to shipping from air & subs -
2. Trained in lone wolf - stealth operations
Need develop techniques
Team operations
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 Approved For Release 2003/04/18 : CIA-RDP80BO1554R003600020001-4
Yes - remotely
Soviets building 2 carriers
In time - considerable -
possible - -
Nature Warfare changing
Longer range
quicker
more electronic impact
more difficult to hide/deceive
Easier predict outcome -
therefore less likely happen
Bi-polar - greater emphasis on readiness for big war
Multi-polar - premium on flexibility-of military forces
for. unexpected
Multi-increased use of Navy as arm of diplomacy
Nations more likely shift
.their alignment on issues
Approved For Release 2003/04/18 : CIA-RDP80BO1554R003600020001-4
 Appro 'F 1 eM0$M/ ~ CIA-RDP80BO1554R003600020001-4
No- England's separation from continent of
20 miles in 18th - 19th - greater than ours of 3,000 today
Age of missiles and Nuclear weapons -
never remote from battlefields as was England
Age delicate balancing of economic,
diplomatic and military power, never can be
indifferent to fate of an. ally.
No - Reenlistment rates are up markedly -
Congress has improved pay
Z has improved conditions
life
Job market not as good
Tempo of overseas operations
Must keep working - AVF - intend to do so
Approved For Release 2003/04/18 : CIA-RDP80BO1554R003600020001-4
 Approved For Release 2003/04/18 : CIA-RDP80BO1554R003600020001-4
HOUSING
NOT SO - CAN TAKE YOU JUST A.FEW MILES TO NEW EM HOUSING AS NICE AS
,ANY OFFICERS. AND MORE UNITS AVAILABLE EVERY YEAR. NAVY PUSHED HARD
LAST 4 YEARS FOR MORE AND BETTER HOUSING.
HOUSING ALLOWANCE NOT ADEQUATE FOR THOSE CAN NOT LIVE IN GOVERNMENT
HOUSING - CONGRESS DID INCREASE IT NOT LONG AGO.
ADVANCEMENT
NOT' DISCOURAGING. - IS.,. TANTALIZING
MOST NAVY MEN UNDERSTAND REASON
LEGAL-OILING NUMBER. MEN EACH GRADE
AS ONE LEAVES/PROMOTED - OPENING
IF NO ONE WAITING IN LINE, OPPORTUNITY GOES VACANT AND PAY LOST
WHY HAVE QUAL EXAMS 2 YEAR LAST MAN CAN WAIT 6 MO
BUT RECENTLY SHORTAGES PERSONNEL FUNDS
FORCED LONGER WAITING LEST TO SAVE $
ADDITION - PROUD OF OUR SYSTEM - NO CHANCE - FAIR AND OBJECTIVE
EM NAVY WIDE TEST
OFFICERS - STATUTORY BOARD
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 Approved F&r das 2OO 4/1Z~ P80BO1554R003600020001-4
DEFINITELY NO -
EVEN AVF CONSIDERABLE NUMBER CIVILIANS COMING AND GOING
ONLY WANT ABOUT 30% REENLISTMENT
PYRAMID
SELECTIVITY
DO NEED ENSURE DRAWING ALL SECTORS COUNTRY - GEOGRAPHICALLY,
ECONOMICALLY, SOCIALLY, ETHNICALLY, ETC. NEED BE CONSCIOUS IN
RECRUITING
ALSO NEED BE CONSCIOUS IMPORTANCE MAINTAINING DIALOGUE
CIVILIAN WORLD.
TWO WAY STREET -
AVF MEANS CIVILIANS MUST INCREASE NOT DECREASE INTEREST IN
MILITARY
RACISM
EMPHATICALLY NO - WE HAVE MADE EFFORTS OVER 20 YEARS OPEN
OPPORTUNITIES MINORITIES.
REMEMBER INCIDENT 1951
MISSED WHOLE ISLAND
NAVY IS BEHIND IN #'S - WORKING TO CORRECT
MEANTIME - PERCEIVED RACISM
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 Approved For Releas ` ~ hI 1A-RDP80BO1554R003600020001-4
FEEL VERY REAL RESPONSIBILITIES
RECEIVE WONDERFUL SUPPORT - ESPECIALLY NEWPORT
WORK HARD AT COOPERATION AND COMMUNITY RELATIONS - CHURCH,
SCOUTING, LITTLE LEAGUE, BOY'S CLUB, PTA, ETC.
STILL, OUR MISSION IS TO PROVIDE MOST DEFENSE FOR TAX PAYER'S DOLLAR.
CAN NOT JUSTIFY EXPENDITURES FOR REASONS OF BOLSTERING THE-ECONOMY,
OTHER AS DIRECTED BY CIVILIAN AUTHORITIES
YOU CAN APPRECIATE HOW EXPENSIVE AND DESTORTED OUR MILITARY
ESTABLISHMENT COULD BE IF NEVER COULD CHANGE.
PREDICT IMPACT ON NEWPORT SUBSTANTIALLY LESS THAN FORECAST
MANY PEOPLE LEAVING SPEND LESS 37% INCOME IN R.I.
POLITICAL FACTORS
Theoretically some savings might be possible
But expense in long run great
Country built on responsiveness of government to citizens
Soviet Union government can align bases without
political factors - but I would not trade
Approved For Release 2003/04/18 : CIA-RDP80BO1554R003600020001-4 29
 Approved For Release 2003/04/18 : CIA-RDP80BO1554R003600020001-4
In democratic government never want one element predominate
more appropriate
Eisenhower was warning against lack alertness
to this in 1 area
Fact you asked? indicates is a balancing -
I think reasonable
Navy recently struck some hard bargains - 2 giants
Litton - Grumman
Some measure coop essential to security -
Build house - work architect & builder
MID CAREER OFFICERS - EXPAND HORIZONS
COME TO US TECHNICAL BACKGROUND EXPERIENCE, TRAINING, EDUCATION
BLACK & WHITE
PREPARE FOR BROADER PROBLEMS LIE AHEAD - UNCERTAIN, INEACT
ONE WAY LOOK -
HAVE BEEN ANSWERING?
NOW ASK - IS RIGHT?
31
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 Approved For Release 2003/04/18 : CIA-RDP80BO1554R003600020001-4
SCHOOL VS SHIP .
NO - JUST DIFFERENT
BEAUTY NAVY CAREER IS VARIETY EXPERIENCES
M.Lz :CES LIFE INTELLECTUALLY VITAL
2 1/2 YRS CTG - ?D
FLEW
HELO - SURPRISE INSPECTIONS
TRIED IMAGINE SOV ADM THINKING DEALT MEN ACTION
IN BETWEEN
ANALYZED. DECISIONS INVOLVING $
DEALT MEN KEEN MANGES/POL
DELVING INTO HISTORY, PEDAGOGY - DEAL MEN OF ACADEMIC PROMESS
DISTAFF
BEAUTIFULLY-
ENTHUSIASM
REASONABLE ATTENDANCE
WIVES DID WELL -
GREAT ? IMAGINATION
DEM-LND- NEXT YEAR
;{WORTHWHILE - KEEP HUSBAND AND WIFE TEAM CLOSE
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 Approved For Release 2003/04/18 : CIA-RDP80B01554R003600020001-4
FET,LALES
Growing - only waiting constitutional amendment
Part effort take every reasonable step meet manpower
requirements in AVF.
UNDERSTAND PEOPLE
1st - Don't think our people as isolated as suggest
Stressed need appreciate importance understanding national will -
Opinion
Servants
Major conference with media
Race relations training
Contemporary Civilization
Art
Movie
F'ut i r e
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 Approved For Release 2003/04/18 : CIA-RDP80B01,554R003600020001-4
DISOBEY ORDER'S
O N RELATIONS
Believe well aware need
human relations
Stress - decision no good if ...
Remember - education - not training
Not "how to do it" all -
Take forever -
Make conscious need and how to approach
IMAGE
YES - IMAGE MILITARY CREATES IS INCREASINGLY IMPORTANT AS ACCENT
MISSION OF DETERRING -
SAME TIME CAN'T DO JOB WITH MCRRORS OR MADISON AVE TECHNIQUES
'=:-POTEMKIN VILLAGE - SEEN THROUGH
STILL - MUST LEARN 'TO CONSIDER IMPACT IMAGE SMALL AND LARGE SHOW OF FORCE
MUST ALSO CONSIDER IMPACT STATEMENTS OPINIONS POTENTIAL ADVERSARIES
AND- 3RD NATIONS
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 Approved For Release 2G05084/l81 CIA-RDP80BO1554R003600020001-4
WAR INVOLVES KILLING
KILLING IMMORAL
WAR I MMO RAL
WHAT PEOPLE MEAN IS MJRE OR LESS MORAL - JUST USE OF
MORALITY CONFUSES ISSUE - MAKES IT APPEAR BLACK-AND WHILE.-STANDARD
EXISTS -
INSTEAD MUST LOOK AT LEACH ACTION - STEP LEAD TO WAR - BEST
CAN DO UNDER CIRCUMSTANCES.
POLICEMAN KILLS ASSAILANT JUST BEFORE MURDER - COMMITING LEAST
IMMORAL ACT UNDER CIRCUMSTANCES
KILL THOUSANDS
Consequences to those and other thousands be as bas or worse
if plan not exist
Undoubtedly have plans
Nuclear war -
Existence of plans & capability what deters
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 Approved For Release 2003/04/18 : CIA-RDP80B01554R003600020001-4
r,Tn~n nor r,~r,~r, C'
JIJVDA 2 V11LL1\J
UNL AWF UZ
Steal, murder, lie, cheat
Standards decency - morality
Individual issue -
Consequences worth it
Nelson's blind eye
events overtaken orders -
Rowan
Burke
GREATEST DANGER
Apathy
Strength will intelligence do whatever necessary -
Our way government and principles freedom individual root
source that strength
But - participation by people is basic foundation
41
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 Approved For Release 2003/04/18 : CIA-RDP80BO1554R003600020001-4
NAVY THREAT
Scylle and Charybdis
Schyll of pricing ourselves out
the requisite capability
Charybdis of not being-able to 'afford -what modern
technology demands as minimum capabilities
People - over extended
Can't replay VN without greater resources
Approved For Release 2003/04/18 : CIA-RDP80BO1554R003600020001-4