OFFICE OF SECURITY FIELD CHIEFS
Document Type:
Collection:
Document Number (FOIA) /ESDN (CREST):
CIA-RDP80B01554R003000340001-5
Release Decision:
RIPPUB
Original Classification:
K
Document Page Count:
18
Document Creation Date:
December 9, 2016
Document Release Date:
July 25, 2001
Sequence Number:
1
Case Number:
Publication Date:
October 4, 1979
Content Type:
SPEECH
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Body:
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OFFICE OF SECURITY FIELD CHIEFS
4 October 1979
. . . . as much attention to as any since I have been here, and
which I feel is as important a responsibility as any, is the recruitment
of new people. This is a marvelous Agency, it has had a history and a
tradition of super people and we have probably the finest group of
professionals that is in any organization of the government. But you
cannot be in charge of it and not feel a great responsibility to see
that that continues into the future. I therefore feel that paying
attention to the recruiting, getting the right people on board is
critical and you play a key role in that. I want you to know that it
has my personal attention and support in any way we can for you.
Beyond that, your boss, Bob Gambino, gets more of my time and
attention than he deserves. For reasons unrelated to him or to you, we
in this country have more security problems today than we ought to have.
Most of them are things you and I cannot do anything about. But the one
thing that really bothers me when we talk about security problems, and I
have done this--not here in OS--with groups like Mid-Career Courses that
I talk to, and I go around the table and I say, what would you do to
improve security? I get an answer, well, you have Congress pass a law.
What would you do? Well, I'd have the Defense Department stop
But I get exasperated and I say, what are you going to do with your
office?
My philosophy is that security starts at your desk, at our desk,
and it is discouraging to people when they know the leaks are coming
from other places. But it does not alleviate the responsibility
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to take care of it in your desk, in your office, in your Directorate,
whatever it may be in our Agency. I have to go brief that to the
Congress, to the Defense Department, to the National Security Council,
to everybody. If organizations will try to take care of its own thing,
maybe we'll begin to chip away at the problem. We are putting an awful
lot of attention on the work that the Office of Security has done on it.
It has been super and with all the limits, problems, and impedences that
we have got, we are doing a great deal.
The biggest and most important thing from our Agency's point of view,
in my opinion, is to just tighten individual awareness of security.
Again, the way you handle the security aspects of your jobs really is a
critical part of this because it starts out there in the field when we
try to make sure we don't get the lemon, the person who is going to turn
unreliable, into the organization to begin with. Or we uncover aberrant
behavior or whatever it may be that indicates massive problems of
somebody who has been on board and is being reinvestigated.
Let me just one or two words about the overall state of the Agency
today. I think we have lots of cause to be optimistic. Our product is
good. Our product is well received around town. Our product is sought
after by the Secretary of State, Secretary of Defense, Brzezinski, and
the President. We get lots of bad reports when we don't predict every-
thing that happens in the world and you know, and I know, that is the
fate of an intelligence organization. We have not been nearly as remiss
as the press would say in Iran and particularly here in the Cuban
situation. The President has stoutly defended the fact that there is
not an intelligence failure in this crisis. You will note in contrast
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to Iran that the Administration has not gone around slicing itself up as
they did trying to make us the scapegoat. There is no question that was
all internal backbiting that hurt us in Iran. The President laid down
the word here that he had gone through this and thought that we had done
a good job.
The point at stake here is that we weren't trying to find 2,000-
3,000 Soviets who were the only Soviets in Cuba; we weren't trying
to find the 40 Soviet tanks that were the only Soviet tanks in Cuba; or
the 68 APCs that were the only ones in Cuba. We were trying to distin-
guish between the 8,000 or 9,000 Soviets who were in Cuba and the 700 to
800 tanks and the 700 to 900 APCs that are in Cuba whether those portions
of them were allocated to this purpose of being a combat unit training
for combat rather than teaching Cubans. We work in this game in a set
of priorities that are set by others and the record of attention to Cuba
in general, the Soviet ground forces in Cuba as opposed to missiles and
ships and airplanes, is one of not keen interest over the last dozen
years. What brought us to the conclusion we have come to was a classic
intelligence operation in which communications intelligence told us what
to look for. When we got the pictures we knew what we were looking at
because of what we got in communications and because of all this we had
gone out and asked one of our human agents to verify a portion of this
and he did it, nailed it down for us and within a few days in late
August it all came together. It has been exciting and it has been
indicative of the kind of real success that we can have when we apply
our talents across the board here.
We are collecting good intelligence today. We are collecting
it with the vastly improving technical systems. They are bringing in so
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much data that one of our new challenges is how to process and handle
it, massage it, and retrieve it because it defies getting humans to
handle it all. We have got to do it with computers. It is a real
challenge. In spite of a lot of the stories you read, John McMahon, the
head of the DDO, will tell you that last year was the best year on
record for the DDO in terms of productivity. Now all these complaints
that we have fired everybody, the morale is low, and all that kind of
thing is exaggerated in the first place. In the second place, the thing
that pays off is does the product come in. We have more agents recruited
last year than we did the year before and the year before that and they
are doing very well. On top of that, I believe they are even more
responsive today to fitting into where we need them. You don't try to
solve all the answers with the spys. You try to solve the answers you
can't get pictures of with a satellite or you can't get a signals
intercept on, because those are easier, cheaper, less risky. We are
doing, I think, a better job in teamwork, in dovetailing those elements
together.
Finally, I would say from my vantage point our position with
the public, with the Congress, with the Administration is stronger and .
we have more support today by far than we had when I was privileged to
join you two and a half years ago. I just came back a couple of weeks
ago from seven 3-hour testimonies on the Hill about Cuba--back-to-back
in a week--and the thrust of this was not, why did you goof off; it was,
why didn't you ask for more money, why didn't you ask for more people,
why didn't you have a better intelligence, we want more intelligence.
And that, I tell you, is a stark contrast to a couple of years ago. You
get that in the public arena yourself. Look at what has been in the
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press the last year as compared with a couple of years ago when we were
still reading about MKULTRA and everything they could dig out. Now
there is still the guy who lashes out at us. There is Joe Trento who
wants to make a saint out of Paisley and Paisley was a great guy, but
Trento won't let him go until he makes a Pulitzer Prize on the Paisley
story I guess. But, overall, the tone has certainly shifted in our
direction.
I am sorry I missed my appointed schedule with you this morning
because I was down looking at whether and how we are going to get more
money into our next budget. We had a meeting with all the top people
downtown and the President promised in his speech the other night and
Monday we're going to do more surveillance in Cuba, we are going to
improve our capabilities for looking at Cuban-Soviet affairs around the
world. I snuck the word capabilities in, he had something else in there
when the first draft came out. You do those things a little bit here
and a little bit there and we're moving along. We will meet with the
President on that question tomorrow. I met with him yesterday on it as
a matter of fact privately, but we'll have a overall meeting with him on
it tomorrow. There is not going to be a pot of gold, you are not
suddenly going to find your staffs are doubled and all this kind of
thing, I don't want to overdo it. I am just trying to say to you that
the climate, the atmosphere, the trends are all in a better and a more
healthy direction for us. I find the attitudes around the Agency are
healthier overall. I think we have every opportunity to do what all
of us want to do and that is to ensure that we are each making a contri-
bution, not only for today but for the next decade; that when we leave
feel that we have done something that will help to ensure the country
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has the CIA and making 1989 as good as it is in 1979. I talked longer
than I wanted to, let's start and see what you have got on your mind.
QUESTIONS & ANSWERS
Q: From time to time the media addresses the question of the wisdom
of having the DDO type operation continue to be wedded with the NFAC
type operation in the same organization and we hear voices raised
from time to time about separating those two. Any comment on where
that might stand at this point?
A: That is a very minor set of has never come up in the Congres-
sional hearing, for instance. That is where you would find it
bubbling if there was really some steam behind it; that is something
I never have to pay any attention to. The one that people raise a
little more than that is should the covert action portion of the DDO
be segmented off into a--and nobody says where. The Defense Department
doesn't want it, State Department certainly doesn't want it, so do
you create now "The Covert Action Agency" out here? That is just
the thing the liberals who propose trying to get rid of it out of
here wouldn't want. I answer that one quickly because if you had
a whole agency to deal with covert action, you'd probably end up
with some covert action--bureaucrats find work to do and we, I
think, keep it in balance, in proportion is the words that are
needed. I have no concern about somebody fragmenting off the DDO.
This is not a problem.
A: The size of the so-called combat brigade in Cuba seems to be relatively
small. What is the threat?
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There is no military threat to the United States. There is a theoret-
ical military threat to Central America or Latin America if they
were to be bold enough to inject it into some revolutionary situation.
It only took a couple of dozen Cubans to turn the tide in Nicaraga
in our opinion and the they represented. We think the
Cuban participation in Nicaraga was crucial but small. The Sandinistas
a year ago last month almost made it. They didn't make it; it was
the Cuban help between then and the spring and then at the critical
moment in the spring that made the second go successful for them.
Now, if you look on the broader scale, what it represents is a
Cuban-Soviet alliance, an earnest of Soviet support for these Cuban
activities in Angola, Ethiopia, Yemen, and who knows where next.
Ironically we say it is not a training unit, there are a lot of
people who I think understand if we say it would be a greater threat
if it were a training unit. If it were really cranking out Cuban
mercenaries in big order and sending them all around the world, we
would have more to be worried about than a bunch of guys with tanks
and mortars in Cuba.
Q: Would you comment, Admiral Turner, on the cooperation you are getting
currently from the Community?
A: I think it has improved. I didn't talk about the Community very
much but I put a lot of my personal time in this office in being the
DCI as opposed to being head of our Agency. The President felt,
when he appointed me, and I have felt since I've been here, that it
is important that we bring the Community closer together. The
President gave me authority over the budgets and when it came to the
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question, are we going to get a supplemental as the result of the
President's speech, there was no question in anybody's mind that it
was the DCI who was going to pull that supplemental together and,
boy, they all came in with their suggestions, their requests--it
totaled $600 million, we have to pare it down obviously. I did that
with nobody contesting, "You can't decide whether NSA's thing goes
above CIA's." So that is working well. We really do have control
of the budget process and I think the other agencies recognize that
it is working better for them in this way. We got a good hearing
and instead of a committee voting, and committees don't vote because
it is logical, I can look at them now around a table and I say, now
knock off that crap, don't give me that stuff, tell me what you
really need, because I'm going to back it up with this fellows. If
you don't put a convincing case forward, he's going to win. Whereas
before, when it was a committee they were playing to, it was histri-
onics and wasn't useful debate. The action in Cuba, dovetailing the
communications, the photos, and the human intelligence, that wasn't
one agency, that was three organizations that had to pull that off.
So, we're not there yet. People don't want, in my opinion, a DCI.
Nobody wants to give up anything to more centralized control. I
don't want to take control for the sake of control, but there are a
lot of voids that aren't being filled. My office has been involved
in one that is going to be very much a concern of the Office of
Security. We handled it outside of the Security Office thus far,
and that is setting up a whole new codeword system. Our codeword
system is a mess. Why? Because NSA developed one, the Reconnais-
sance Office developed another, the HUMINT people never developed
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one. If you are a contractor and want to send this document in--
if it is under the NSA rules, you wrap it three times and seal it
twice; and if it is under the NRO rules, you wrap it twice and seal
it three times. We had a conference on that last week and I asked
the contractors, does this bother you that you have manuals from
different people telling you how to do the same thing? They said
Si, it just screws us all up, we have to have contracts with both
organizations. So we are trying to fill some of these necessary
voids, not just grab all the power and do things. We're trying to
step in where there is a need for more coordination. It comes
gradually. In some areas like the budget, it is just working great.
Other areas they fight me tooth and nail over the most minute kind
of thing, you just can't believe it.
Are we making any progress in the legislative arena as far as
relaxing requirements of the FOIA and Privacy Act as far as the
CIA is concerned?
A: Yes. I'm sorry I didn't bring it with me but there is a sentence
in the President's speech on this and it says we are going to take
steps to safeguard our sources and methods of collecting intelligence.
What I have proposed, and it came down to that one sentence, was the
rapid submission of the FOIA relief legislation. Legislation to
make it a criminal offense to willingly disclose the identity of
undercover CIA personnel and legislation to let us more easily get
protective orders in a court case so that classified information can
be utilized but not exposed, protected. The defense can see it but
they can't talk about it and so on. Those are three pieces of
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legislation that we are working on. I don't want you to hope that
this is going to be passed before Christmas because it isn't. All
of this is helping and there is more pressure on today than there
was before and now it is welling out of the Congress. We've got
several Bills on these same subjects from the Congress coming back,
some of those aren't quite acceptable to us but out of it I think we
have a claimant where we havea 40 percent chance of getting something
next year; whereas six months ago it was a 15 percent chance. Maybe
by January I'll even be over the 50 percent mark.
Q: I started to ask along that same line, where do you see the Congress
going on charter legislation, if anywhere?
A: That is a really tough one. We're getting pretty close with the
Senate committee on agreement here. There are just a few things
that are still real strong feelings between us that are different.
The House has just not paid attention to it yet and clearly they
don't want to just rubber stamp a Senate thing no matter how good it
is. As you would appreciate, even though we get agreement with the
Senate committee, there is going to be the right-wingers who say its
too restrictive and the left-wingers who say it doesn't restrict us
at all. There is a real danger of getting caught in that cross-fire
and stymied. I think that would be bad for us. I really do and let
me say, oversight by the Congress, charters by the Congress is a
very controversial subject. I am going to the lion's den tomorrow
at Noon and speak to the AFIO crowd who think charters are the end
of the world--I believe anyway from what I have read of some of
their things. I'm going to tell them as I tell you that I think the
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charter has more benefit to us than problem as long as we keep some
of the things out, and there are only a couple of things left that I
will bleed over. We have worked it now to where it is reasonable.
We know where we stand. We have also got firm things in there about
what we are supposed to do--it is a charter to do as well as a
charter to control. I also want to be sure everybody appreciates
that it sets out what is the oversight procedure. But we do have to
continue working and it is going alright right now, but we have to
worry in the future that oversight not become management. This
charter will spell out the oversight role, if you see what I mean.
It is good to have that spelled out for us. Beyond that, we can
never forget that while I think we are getting much more public
support for what we do, there is still a public suspicion of what we
do that we don't do but they think we do or might do. If the
charters just flounder for years now, that suspicion will continue
more so I think than it will if we get the charters through.
Q: On a much more pedestrian level, let me just make a comment. My
men, definitely in , appreciate the little personal notes you
will write, notes of thanks after you have visited our area, to the
point that some men even say occasionally, when is the Admiral
coming? Which is very unusual.
A: Thank you. I should have mentioned that in my remarks but I really
do appreciate the support that I get wherever I travel because, and
I say this with great sincerity, I have never felt, let alone ever
voiced, a complaint about the performance of anybody in your organ-
ization. Now I'm talking about the super guys who are assigned to
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my security staff. They rotate through on two-year tours so I've
seen a lot of them now. And when I go out in the field and your
people support me there, nobody has ever missed knowing where to go,
missed being thoughtful, courteous, trying to find any possible way
to help us. And I really appreciate it. I know it is a burden when
you've got all these other things going on and it takes away from
your efforts. I don't want to more of a burden than necessary. I
don't really want you to put more people on my travel operations
than absolutely necessary to do the job.
Q: Admiral, one of the cases that is having a real debilitating effect
on people around the Community that are working the leak problem is
the Jack Anderson case. He seems to be just, you know, he's thrown
the gauntlet down and publicly announced that he has all these
classified documents and, as you know, we have identified the ones he
has and so on. Is there any hope that Justice will move on that
thing either criminally or civilly?
A: Well we had a Community leader breakfast this morning and that was
a subject we talked about for 10 minutes, specifically Jack Anderson.
And yes, there is opposition in the Justice Department to prosecuting
him for having had possession of these. We are working with them on
an alternative which is to prosecute for the return of the documents.
I think anything to show that you don't let this blatant violation
of security procedures go unattended would be worthwhile. So I
can't promise you we'll make it even on the fallback position, but I
can only say that we are working it, we're trying hard. We've got a
new Attorney General, that is a setback. The old one was very
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supportive. I have no reason to think Ben Civiletti won't be
equally, but he steps in, he's new, I can't go and ask him to take
sort of major steps all in the first month or two he is in office.
We're working on these things with him. He was very cooperative as
the Deputy over there, but it is going to take a little while to
feel out how aggressive he will be in the national security area.
I was going to say, would you say that reorganization of the Agency
has reached a point where we're satisfied with the system now or are
we still planning on big changes in the future?
A: No, I haven't any changes of any great significance in mind at this
time. Just working over this morning a proposal on something called
the Executive Committee we set up 4, 5, 6 months ago. I found that
there was no regular forum for me to sit around the table with the
Agency leaders and say, how do we attack this problem from an Agency
point of view? I have a morning meeting three times a week but they
come with the daily problems thing not, how do we tackle a major
issue that confronts us? So we set up the Executive Committee of
the four Deputy Directors, the DDCI and myself to do that. Well,
this morning we're talking about where does the Executive Secretary
of the Executive Committee report. He used to report to the Comp-
troller, but that was because Jim Taylor was the guy I wanted to run
the Executive Committee. Now he has moved to DDS&T and so we have
to relocate or decide if we leave in the Comptroller the Executive
Committee function. So around here but I haven't for I
guess for over a year now had anything in mind in terms of any major
structural reorganization. This morning we announced a small
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in the NI0s, the National Intelligence Officers. They're a collegial
group up there of a dozen or fourteen people, each with one or two
assistants, and we now put Dick Lehman in charge of coordinating
them. One guy puts his priority on working interagency memos,
another on Agency memos, for they work for both the Agency and the
Community. We are just trying to get it a little focused is all.
If those things bother you, that will go on forever
you want to propose? While I don't have any in mind I'm
What I am trying to say to you is I've neither a hidden plan or some
'inner drive to keep changing the organiztion. But I hope I'm a
progressive in the sense that if I can see a good idea, I'm willing
to try. What would you like to have organized?
Response: I was thinking in terms of continuity and stability and the
good feeling that goes with a dedicated, spirited organization.
A: Well, continuity, stability
Response: And good productivity too.
A: I can't guarantee my continuity as I read in the paper every day that
I'm being fired. Nobody has ever suggested it to me at any official
level. I can only assure you that I have worked for the government
all my life and I'm willing to do it as long as my superiors want me
to. I survived the.... (tape turned) .... I've never worked in my
life; I've been in the government all this time. Like to go out and
try the other side too. I would like to see more continuity and one
of the things I'm really trying to do to promote that is emphasize
personnel management. If you look carefully behind some of the
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personnel moves that have just taken place around the top levels
here, there is a method in my madness. You take Jim Taylor who was
the Comptroller, super guy. But his field was only Comptroller,
that is all he has ever done for us. Putting him in DDS&T, in a
couple of years now I've got a horse I can put a lot of places,
right? You take Ev Hineman, who is out of the weapons part of NFAC
up in the number 2 job, so he is not getting into economics and
politics; and I've got another horse here. You take John McMahon,
who has been in DDS&T, been in OTS, now he is running the DDO. I
don't want to get too much into personalities here, but I'm just
saying that if you move people around a little bit, you don't get
put in a situation I was put in, in my opinion--I may be wrong--when
Hank Knoche retired. I didn't feel I had a suitably experienced
candidate for that job. And the same when the DDA left. And I
don't ever want to be caught where when any one of the Deputy
Directors, Associate Deputy Directors, or DDCIs leave, that there
aren't two or three candidates, because I, my successors, somebody
else may not like the cut of your jibe, I may not like people with
blue ties. That is irrational but okay. Or, if you only have one
candidate and he decides to die, you are in tough shape. So I'm
trying and I want you to try that. I want this to go through the
Agency, that we all look after our people. Who's going to be the
guy next, if you've got 4 or 5 candidates for it.
Really, I suppose Bob is thinking of all your offices here. STATINTL
Has he got enought candidates coming up so when it is your time to
move on to higher things, to retire, shift to another Directorate,
whatever it may be, that he has groomed people who have had the
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variety of experience, the kind of training courses that will
qualify them. It's really very much needed. I'll be candid with
you. We have been four agencies too long. We've been too cloistered,
too compartmented. I have threatened this for two years now and one
of these very soon days I'm going to break the bureaucracy and order
it. The day is going to come when you don't make supergrade if you
haven't served outside yOur Directorate. Now don't get scared if
you're not a supergrade. I'm not going to just say that and you all
get ruled out. We'll phase it in over a period of time. It probably
won't affect many people of your stature at all, but it will affect
those GS-12s coming along here because somewhere between there and
GS-15, the good ones are going to demand to do that. And why?
Because the top managers have got to understand more than one strain
of the organiztion. When you get to be a supergrade, you represent
the organization, you don't represent a Directorate or an office.
I have leaned on Bob probably as tough as anybody in the organization
since I've been here. We were only here a few months when he really
got me interested in the Boyce-Lee case. Right, Bob? What he has
accomplished since we really got mean about the Boyce-Lee case is
really substantial. Last week we had the contractor security people
in and the time I spent with them I was very impressed. I was very
impressed with their cooperativeness, their recognition that we were
.... about this problem, and their willingness to get in and help.
And their gratefulness for the attention that you have given them,
which includes surprise inspections and a lot of things that people
aren't normally happy with but you're doing because they've got to
be done. We had the unfortunate Kampiles case and I saw a little
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bit of Bob on that one. He spearheaded a super report on that. It
almost did what you've suggested. It might have made him DDCI
(Security) but, seriously, it was a good report. We've put a lot of
it into action and some things we're still trying to find ways to
accomplish. So we've had a lot of interface, Bob and I have, and
things have always been responsive and that's the hallmark of your
organization. We're appreciative of it. It is just an essential
part of this business. You cannot have intelligence without security.
I don't need to preach that to you, but I think we are getting more
and more attention to that and it is going to pay off. I give a
speech tonight to the National Security Industrial Association and
half of it is on security; FOIA I mention, FOIA legislation, give
examples of how we've put 2 man-years per year for the last three
years on Agee. I tell them it is ridiculous this government has a
man who says he wants to tear down and disestablish a legal, author-
ized paid for organ of the government and we have two men, full-time,
working to provide him help doing that. Now I don't mind paying for
guys who want to know whether we've got their names in the files and
said something nasty about them or something like that. We're a
free society and the citizens deserve to know what is going on. But
when the fellow's avowed purpose is to thwart what the Congress and
the President have authorized and we help him with it, we're almost
insane. We're taking the time to drive these things home to the
public these days so we get that support that will carry the necessary
legislation to the Congress. But let me come back, it's the kind of
work you do that is the cornerstone of this and we have got to have
security at every step along the way. So I hope you will help me
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preach. Don't look just for the Congress to solve the security
problem that the country has got. If we'll each just worry about
our own security problems, whatever our own sphere is, it will all
piece together in due course and we'll improve the situation. It is
just very injurious to our profession, to our contribution to the
country if we can't tighten up in a lot of these areas. I know a lot
of it is not within our particular purview and we're working on that
also, but let's all keep going in our own area and do the job as you
all do it so well in your sphere. I'm grateful to you and thanks
for the time.
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