SOVIET SPACE TECHNOLOGY

• Document Type: CREST
• Collection: General CIA Records
• Document Number (FOIA) /ESDN (CREST): CIA-RDP63T00245R000100290011-7
• Release Decision: RIPPUB
• Original Classification: K
• Document Page Count: 198
• Document Creation Date: December 16, 2016
• Document Release Date: August 24, 2004
• Sequence Number: 11
• Publication Date: May 29, 1959
• Content Type: OPEN

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SOVIET SPACE TECHNOLOGY
HEARINGS
BEFORE THE
COMMITTEE ON
SCIENCE AND ASTRONAUTICS
AM) SPECIAL SUBCOMMITTEE ON
LUNIK PROBE
U.S. HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES
EIGHTY-SIXTH CONGRESS
FIRST SESSION
MAY 11, 12, 13, 14, 28, 29, AND EXECUTIVE SESSIONS OF
MAY 12 AND 14, 1959
[No. 46]
Printed for the use of the Committee on Science and Astronautics
UNITED STATES
GOVERNMENT PRINTING OFFICE
48438 WASHINGTON : 1959
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COMMITTEE ON SCIENCE AND ASTRONAUTICS
OVERTON BROOKS, Louisiana, Chairman
YOFIN W, McCORMACK, Massachusetts
GEORGE P. MILLER, California
OLIN E. TEAGUE, Texas
VICTOR L. ANFCSO, New York
B, F. SISK, California
EltWIN MITCHELL, Georgia
JAMES M. QUIGLEY, Pennsylvania
DAVID M. HALL, North Carolina
LEONARD 0. WOLF, Iowa
JOSEPH E. KARTII, Minnesota
KEN IIECLILER, West Virginia
EMILIO Q. DADDARIO, Connecticut
WALTER 11. MOELLER, Ohio
DAVID S. KING, Utah
J. EDWARD ROUSH, Indiana
ClIARLER F. DueANDER, Ruralise Director and Chief Courad
Dr. CHARLES S. SUELDON II, Technical Director
SPENCER M. BERERVORD, Special Counsel
PHILIP B. YEArVER, Special Canard:ant
I! Annus S. BOLIAPT, Staff Consultant
JOHN A. CARSPARPSEN, Jr.,. Counsel
RICHARD P. mNE% Nag Consultant
Lt. Cot. PAUL B. SCHEPPS:1ER, :`.+7,4ff CantuRant
RAYMOND WILCOVE, Staff Consultant
JOSEPH W. MARTIN, Is., Massachusetts
JAPdES G. FULTON, Pennsylvania
GORDON L. McDONOUOH, CalUorula
J. EDGAR CIIENOWETII, Colorado
FRANK C. OSMERS, ht., New Jamey
WILLIAM K. VAN PELT, Wisconsin
A. D. B.A.CMLIART. Ia., Ohio
PERKLNS BASS, New Ibunpshire
R. WALTER RIEIILMAN, New York
SPECIAL Suncommrtna; oi LUNLK. PROBE
VICTOR L. ANFU&O, New York, Chairman
LEONARD O. WOLF, Iowa FRANK C. OSMERS, JR., New Jersey
JOSEPH E. KARTH, Minnesota WILLIAM K. VAN PELT, Wisconsin
DAVID R. ICING, Utah
SPErfeita M. Bausasoan, Special Counsel
It
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CONTENTS
Executive sessions? Page
May 12, 1959 77
May 14, 1959 131
Statement of?
Benham, Thomas A., professor of physics, Haverford College, Haver-
ford Pa 47
Curtis, Dr. Harold 0.' Associate Director, Project Space Track, Air
Force, Cambridge Research Center, Bedford, Mass 197
Daigh, Ralph, editorial director and vice president, Fawcett Publica-
tions 137
Dryden, Dr. Hugh, Deputy Administrator, National Aeronautical
and Space Administration 59, 77
Fox, Lt. Col. James A., Chief, Space Systems Branch, Air Technical
Intelligence Center, Dayton, Ohio 99
Godel, William, Advanced Research Projects Administration, Depart-
ment of the Army 109
Hall, Col. Linscott A., Deputy Director of Estimate, Office, Assistant
Chief of Staff, Intelligence, USAF 99
Malian, Lloyd, author of "The Big Red Lie," accompanied by Ralph
Daigh, vice president, Fawcett Publications 5, 137, 193
Newell, Dr. Homer E., Jr., Assistant Director, Space Sciences, Office
of Space Flight Development 59, 77
Pickering, Dr. William H., Jet Propulsion Laboratory, California Insti-
tute of Technology 59, 77
Shapley, Dr. Alan H.' Assistant Chief, Radio Propagation Physics
Division, National Bureau of Standards, Boulder Laboratories,
Boulder, Colo 177
Singer, Dr. S. Fred, associate professor of physics, University of Mary-
land 85
Slavin, R. M., Director, Project Space Track, Air Force, Cambridge
Research Center, Bedford, Mass 197
Stewart, Dr. Homer Joseph, Director, Office of Program Planning and
Evaluation, National Aeronautics and Space Administration 209
Ziegler, Dr Hanz, Department of the Army 109, 131
XII
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SOVIET SPACE TECHNOLOGY
MONDAY, MAY 11, 1959
HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES,
COMMITPEE ON SCIENCE AND ASTRONAUTICS,
Washington,D.C.
The committee met at 10 a.m., in the caucus room, Old House Office
Building, Washington, D.C., Hon. Overton Brooks (chairman) pre-
siding.
The CHAIRMAN. The committee will please come to order.
This morning the committee opens a new hearing. We will meet
here as long as the attendance at the hearings justifies meeting in the
caucus room, provided we get permission to meet here.
The purpose of the hearing now is to establish the authenticity of
Soviet claims as to the sputniks and lunik and also to dig into the
status of scientific advancement in other countries of the world, espe-
cially in the Soviet Union.
We have a number of witnesses scheduled. The hearings are sched-
uled to last a week. If we can move the witnesses up, however, and
hear them faster than we now expect to be able to do, we can finish the
hearings earlier than that. It will depend on the number of questions
and the number of facts that we are able to develop in the course of
the hearings.
I want to first ask the members of the committee if they can hear
me. To start with we have Mr. Lloyd Mallan, who is the author of the
story entitled "The Big Red Lie" which was published in True maga-
zine.
I want to recognize Mr. Anfuso to make a short statement at this
time.
Mr, ANFUSO. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
Mr. Chairman, I should like to make it clear at the outset of these
hearings that the representatives of True magazine which published
this story "The Big Red Lie," Mr. Ralph Daigh, and its author,
Lloyd Malian, a very reputable reporter, both asked for this investiga-
tion, and you were good enough to grant it in order to set the record
straight once and for all.
I believe, in the best interests of the American people, this story
should be fully investigated, and I am glad that you acquiesced in
that. I can assure you, Mr.Daigh and Mr. Malian, that while I cannot
be here for all of the hearings, this committee will be extremely fair
in the interrogation of the witnesses and you will be given every oppor-
tunity to state your case. I am confident that you are motivated
by the best interests of the country in printing and circulating this
article.
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I am equally confident that the same spirit of patriotism will lead
you to retract your story. and to give as much publicity to the retrac-
tion, should it develop in these hearings that the story was unwar-
ranted. Am I correct in stating that, Mr. Daigh and Mr. Malian?
Mr. MALLAN. Yes, you are.
Mr. ANFUSO. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
The CHAIRMAN. Thank you, Mr. A_nfuso.
Before proceeding with the. testimony of Mr. Malian, I wish to say
that we have two important telegrams that the committee has received
and I am going to ask Mr. Beresford, spacial counsel for the commit-
tee, to read those two telegrams.
Mr. BERESTORD. The first is a telegram from the Stanford Research
Institute Station at Menlo Park, Calif. The telegram is dated May 5.
Stanford Research Institute was notified on January 2, 1959, of the launch of
a Russian moon probe. A telephone check with Project Space Track, Air Force
Cambridge Research Center revealed that the official frequencies used were
19.903, 19.995, and 10.097 niegacycles. Furthermore, It was suspected that a
frequency of 71.2 megacycles might be used. Preparations were made at the
Stanford Research Institute field site to monitor these four frequencies. This
monitoring began at approximately 0030 universal time on January 3. The
receiving equipment consisted of the following: Antennas, two 2-element yagies
were used at 20 me. One antenna was vertically polarized, the other horizontally
polarized. Each antenna uses a gamma match to 50 ohm RG FC, equal length of
cable feed a hybrid loop. Add and subtract output of loop, are connected through
equal lengths of cables to receivers. The yagies were movable, 360 degrees in
azimuth. The 7L2 me. antenna is a size element yagi connected directly to
a NEMS-Clark receiver. The 20-megacycle receivers were two Collins 51 J-1's
tuned to approximately 19.093 megacycles. B.F.O. was normally on, AVC off,
Limiter off, BFO filter on 1 kc., crystal filter on positions 2 to 4. Signal was
recorded on an ampex P.R. 1102 converted to P.R. 1104, four-channel record
reproduce machine on half inch tape at 15 IPSW was used. WW1! was re-
corded on first channel. The 20 inc. signals from the vertically and horizontally
polarized channel were recorded on channels 2 and 3. The 71.2 megacycle signal
was recorded on channel 4. The following are notes and comments:
The signal was expected around moonrise January 3 which occurred approxi-
mately at 0915 universal time. Signal was not picked up until 1045 universal
time and was recorded on magnetic type until 1128 u.t. Monitoring continued
until approximately 1300 u.t. The signal was very weak at the beginning and
at no time was it stronger than weak. It appeared to be CW and appeared to
follow the moon by about an hour and a half. There were two types of fading
on the signal. One was generally deep fades In both channels, the other was
polarization fading. The signal shift from vertical to horizontal polarization
and back. etc. It was noted after about 2 hours that the apparent Doppler shift
had reached a value of 1.5 Ice. Comments by trained observers were made to the
effect that this shift was too light for satellite on the way to the moon. It was
attempted to obtain contact with the moon probe on January 4 without success.
Footnote the two Collins receivers had been turned on a minimum of 15 hours.
The signal required almost continuous tuning for peaking. It was too weak to
obtain any factual Doppler shift. Antennas were rotated frequently to maxi-
mize signals. One-minute polarization fades. Longer periods for deep fades.
Nineteen hundred and fifty-eight Delta-2 recorded intermittently on 20.004 me.
between 1110 and 1120 u.t.
The other telegram is from Dr. Lovell, the director of the. Jodrell
Bank Radio Telescope Laboratory in England dated May 8, 1959:
We did not succeed in detecting any signals from lunik. Search was made
with the large radio telescope over a frequency band covering 183.6 megacycles
which was the stated tracking frequency during the night of January 3 to 4
when lunik was said to be close to moon. No tracking errors could account for
failure because telescope beam was adequate to cover position of probe at time
of close approach. Telescope was in similar operational condition which has
enabled us to track Pioneer to 400,000 miles east. We conclude that lunik was
not transmitting continuously at least on this frequency during that night.
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Emphasize that we do not disbelieve in existence of lunik. That frequency might
have been inoperative or some special ground command or other features that
are in existence in America might make it impossible without special apparatus.
We were not forewarned in spite of previous close association with Russian
scientists responsible, neither have we received any satisfactory explanation
from our inquiries by letter to Russia or from the Soviet delegate at The Hague
meeting of Cospar.
The CHAIRMAN. Have you finished them both?
Mr. BERESFORD. Yes.
The CHAIRMAN. Now, Mr. Lloyd Malian is a writer for True maga-
zine. I do not have the date this article came out. What date was
that, Mr. Malian?
Mr. MALLAN. The date, Mr. Chairman, was April 21.
The CHAIRMAN. On April 21 True magazine carried an article enti-
tled "The Big Red Lie," by Lloyd Malian. The purpose of the article
casts grave doubt on whether this was a big Red hoax or whether it
had any elements of the truth in it so we have asked Mr. Malian to
come here this morning and give us his idea of the whole situation
supporting the view that he had taken on the matter. He will be
followed by the other witnesses that we have scheduled.
I think, because of the nature of the inquiry, the witnesses should
be sworn.
Mr. FULTON. Will the chairman yield on a jurisdictional point?
The question comes up on these hearings as to whether they will be
limited to the point of proof or the disproof of the particular missile
flight or whether they will be extended under the questioning on the
hoax to the general field of Russian progress in the missile field. My
own feeling is if we are going to proceed on the question of developing
the truth or falsity of the hoax that we should do so and not under
that particular heading spread it to a general investigation of the
Russian progress in this field. I would, therefore, respectfully request
that the hearings be aimed at the hoax and that if we, as some of the
newspaper accounts have said on Sunday, quoting the chairman, are
to proceed with an investigation of the Russian progress, that we
do that independently of this particular so-called magazine story on
the hoax.
The ClIAIR1VIAN. The Chair as a rule allows the members of the com-
mittee broad latitude in their questions. I would not like to be put
in the position of cutting Mr. Fulton or any other member of the
committee off if they stray a little bit from the story. It is the
pleasure of the committee. We have some witnesses however, that
want to testify on the broad field of Russian progress in science. We
have General Boushey to whom we have allotted a full day who will be
here. What is his name?
Mr. FULTON. Might I ask a question of my colleague Mr. Anfuso,
who heads the Subcommittee on International Cooperation. Is it
your intention to have any hearings on the broad field that the chair-
man and I have outlined?
The CHAIRMAN. I have a schedule mapped out which I would like
to take up in executive session on the subcommittee program.
Mr. FcruroN. Could I preliminarily, then, make a motion that we
for 2 days schedule hearings as a full committee on the question of
this hoax and then have for later decision how we will head the Sub-
committee on International Cooperation.
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The CHAIRMAN. Will you read. the list of witnesses we have, Mr.
Ducander?
Mr. Beresford, do you have a list of all our witnesses?
Mr. Metam Mr. Chairman, I would like to second Mr. Fulton's
motion.
Mr. PRAGUE. We can't tell where this is going to lead, Mr. Chair-
man. I do not concur in this motion. I think we should see just
where it leads.
Mr. MHA,ER. My only thought in seconding the motion is if we are
going to go into the relative field of the Russians in this field, I
would like to see the witnesses. I would like to go into executive
session and get some of our own people before us who I think are
quite competent, in making this judgment and not bring in a lot of
people who will come here and volunteer statements that might be
in contradiction to what our own scientific staff within the Govern-
ment may have and make this a sounding board for a lot of
propaganda.
Mr. FULTON. Would the gentleman from Texas yield?
The CHAIRMAN. Will you fret a, list of the witnesses? We had a
list of the witnesses read into the record last week but I think we
ought to have a list of them now.
Mr. FULTON. Let us separate the jurisdiction of the subcommittee.
That is my point. Where the subcommittee has jurisdiction of in-
ternational cooperation I feel that that portion of the investigation
should be under the subcommittee. If the whole committee wants to
take it, then it should be done separately and not in passing on the
validity of a hoax of a magazine article.
I think the two should he separated and I am respectfully request-
ing that that be considered at this time so that we have the general
course of what we are going to do in these hearings laid out, that the
committee knows and my resolution is a, suggestion.
Mr. TEAGUE. Well, file chairman stated- that he planned to have
an executive session to set out these subcommittee problems and surely
we should not do it this morning.
It should be on an overall basis.
Mr. FULTON. Then why should we not limit our hearings at this
point to simply the hoax and not to the general field of Russian prog-
ress for the time being?
Mr. MILLER. If the gentleman will yield, I will withdraw my
second to his motion? because I think that the committee will spend
most of the day hearing Mr. Malian and other proponents and then,
as I understand it, this executive committee meeting will be held.
When?
The CHAIRMAN. IN' believer we can.
Mr. MILLER. I think, if the executive committee meeting is going
to be held within the near future, before we get further into this thing,
that will take care of it. Otherwise I shall reserve the right to make
that resolution at some future time. I would like us to get our own
housekeeping straightened out before we get far afield.
Mr. ANFUSO. MF. Chairman.
The CHAmmAN. Mr. Anfuso.
Mr. ANFUSO. The only time I could attend an executive hearing
would be today, perhaps sometime this afternoon; then I will be gone
the balance of the week.
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The CHAIRMAN. If we finish with Mr. Mallan early enough, we
can hold it right after we finish with him, just before 12 o'clock.
I do not think we should take much time on that.
Mr. FrruroN. That is satisfactory to me.
Mr. MILLER. Will you withdraw your motion?
The CHAIRMAN. The motion is withdrawn. The second is with-
drawn.
We will proceed, then.
Mr. Mail an, will you take the oath?
Do you solemnly swear that the testimony that you shall give this
committee in matters now under consideration will be the truth, the
whole truth, and nothing but the truth, so help you God?
Mr. MALLAN. Yes ? I do.
The CHAIRMAN. Do you have a prepared statement, Mr. Mallan ?
Mr. MALLAN. No sir; I do not.
The CHAIRMAN. Well, would you like to proceed in your own way?
STATEMENT OF LLOYD MALLAN, NEWS REPORTER, TRUE
MAGAZINE
Mr. MALLAN. I would like to start by recalling the cable from Dr.
Lovell. I thought it was exceptionally significant for the simple
reason that Dr. Lovell, who is the foremost radioastronomer and an
outstanding expert on radiotelescopes, mentioned that his instrument,
the largest mobile radiotelescope in the world or in the free world, was
perfectly tuned and on the 3d and 4th of January tried to find signals
on 183.6 megacycles from the lunik. He failed to find these signals
and his explanation, as I recall the cable, was that undoubtedly the
lunik transmitter on that frequency was not operating.
Yet on January 4 at the Goldstone Dry Lake tracking station on
183.6 megacycles the jet-propulsion laboratory found signals on that
frequency with an 85-foot diameter radiotelescope, which is very ef-
ficient, by the way.
Mr. ANFUSO. Excuse me Mr. Chairman.
The CHAIRMAN. MT. Atifuso.
Mr. ANEUSO. May I say this: Don't you think, Mr. Malian, you are
speaking now like an expert? Don't you think that in the best inter-
ests of your case that you ought to first give us something of your
background?
Mr. MALLAN. Yes Congressman.
The CHAIRMAN. And why not also add to it the facts leading up
to the writing of the article there.
Mr. ANFUSO. That is right.
The CHAIRMAN So that we will have it in chronological order.
Mr. MALLAN. I will try to make this as brief as possible. My back-
ground in astrophysics, which includes radioastronomy and nuclear
physics, astronomy in general, missile research and development,
aviation research and development, space physiology, and a great
many other subjects on a high level, was acquired on a self-trained
basis, on the basis of observations at our own research centers and on
the basis of 20 years' experience as a newspaperman as well as in the
beginning a layman intensely interested in all these aspects of science.
I went to the Carnegie Institute of Technology but in order to make
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this briefer, in the fall of 1957, after the Soviet. Union launched their
first sputnik, Fawcett Publications and True magazine offered to send
me to the Soviet Union to find out or to acquire a. behind-the-scenes
story of the Soviet Union.
The free world spontaneously, almost. as a whole, took the attitude
that the Soviet Union was 'way ahead of the United States and I
had that attitude before entering the Soviet Union.
When I got there., day after day I received shock after shock be-
cause I went there knowing what we were -doing, knowing the type
of research we had engaged in for the past decade or longer in the
field of space medicine, knowing our research in high altitude and
high-speed flight with rocket-powered aircraft.
In fact, I have published several books on the U.S. air research and
development effort, also the air defense effort. So, I expected the
Soviets to have the equivalent, at least, if not something far better,
than we had. I forgot, to mention that. I carried with me letters of
introduction to Soviet scientists, to the leading Soviet scientists, many
of the leading Soviet scientists, from their counterparts in the United
States.
My first interview was with the head of the Soviet Space Flights
Commission, and I was startled when I asked him about. ritdiotele-
scopes which are very necessary for radiotracking, especially over
great distances such as through outer space- -- ---
Mr. Timm:, Mr. Chairman.
The CifArrotAx. Mr. Teague.
Mr. TEAGGt. Mr. .3,fti Ilan, do you speak Russian?
Mr. MAI,LAN. No; I do not.
Mr. TEAGUE. flow did you interview them? How did you inter-
pret?
Mr. MALLAN. I had a girl interpreter who knew no science.
Mr. TEAGUE. The interpreter or yourself?
Mr. MALIAN. Well, she was a member of the Soviet Intourist
Bureau. However, several of the scientists spoke broken English and
the jargon of science is international and many times I corrected her
when she was interpreting things in too literal a manner and not
understanding the words herself in Russian. I also made tape- re-
cordings of a number of these interviews with Russian scientists.
Mr. FULTON. Could we have those submitted for the record, Mr.
Chairman?
The CH AIRMAN. Do you object to submitting those for the record?
Mr. MA I.T.AN. I do not..
The CHAIRMAN. Do you have them there?
Mr. MALIAN. I do. These are only a portion of them, however.
I have transcripts of about half a dozen of them.
Mr. Fmo.N. I move that the transcripts and tape recordings be
put in the record.
The CHAIRMAN. It does not require a motion. If there is no objec-
tion, they will be-placed in the record.
Mr. MIM.rnt At this point I also ask that. Mr. Malian place iii the
record the names of the scientists in this country who gave him the
letters of introduction to the scientists in Russia
Mr. MALIAN. I would be most happy to do that, sir.
(The legible transcripts and list of scientists referred to follow, the.
remainder are in the committee file:)
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INTERVIEW IN MOSCOW WITH PROF. YTJRY POREDONOSTEV AND PROF. KIRIL PETROVICH
STANYTJKOVICII, ARRANGED EY ANATOEY KARPENKO, PERMANENT SECRETARY OF
THE PERMANENT COMMISSION ON INTERPLANETARY COMMUNICATIONS
(Interview by Lloyd Malian, American author)
Comment: This is an interview at the Academy of Sciences, U.S.S.R., arranged
by the scientific secretary, Karpenko. Karpenko is scientific secretary of the
Permanent Commission on Interplanetary Communications of the Academy.
This meeting took place on the day before May Day, April 30, 1958. Present at
the meeting were: Anatoly Karpenko, Prof. Yury Pobedonostev, and Prof. Kiril
Petrovich StanyukoVich. Pobedonostev is professor of aeronautical sciences at
the Moscow Aviation Institute. He also claimed to be the pioneer in flying air-
craft with liquid-rocket assist back in the early 1930's. Professor Stanyukovich
is known as a specialist in gas dynamics and is a professor at the Moscow
Technological Institute. He is also the head of the mathematics department
of that institute. Karpenko had arranged this interview but surprised us with
both Pobedonostev and Stanyukovich; we had expected to be interviewing
Federov, who Karpenko had told us was head of the propulsion institute, and who
recently turned up in Geneva as one of the Soviet scientists consulting on the
control of the setup of the control system for the prevention or detection of
nuclear form experiments. At any rate, we were pleasantly surprised because
both Stanyukovich and Pobedonostev are allegedly top experts in their fields.
As we entered the Academy, Pobedonostev was there waiting. Stanyukovich had
not yet shown up. Pobedonostev greeted us warmly and shook hands. When
I asked whether we might tape record the interview with him (through our
interpreter) he consulted with Karpenko and then said something to the in-
terpreter which she translated to us as "No, he would not like to be taped
during the interview." He felt that using a pencil was much better. Although
this was the day before May Day, one of the biggest holidays in the Soviet
Union, these men were apparently sincerely interested in helping us gather in-
formation for our book. Karpenko had told us over the telephone earlier that they
were going to meet us after they completed their workday. Karpenko sat in on all
of the discussions. Before the arrival of Stanyukovich, I began to ask Pobedono-
stev questions.
Question. Is there a special space flight program set up for the future?
Answer. Yes, there is a special program set up for the future of space flight.
The return of a dog to earth would be the first step.
Question. Have you experimented with any manned or rocket-powered air-
craft?
Answer. During the International Geophysical Year we are exploring the upper
atmospheric regions. Our first step is to get back containers from the satellites
with recording apparatus; then, we will try for the return of animal containers.
Comment: At this point, Pobedonostev opened his briefcase and whipped
out a copy of Missiles and Rockets magazine. He explained to our interpreter
that he wanted to show us an article. This article appeared in the February
1958 issue of Missiles and Rockets, which was a special issue dedicated to elec-
tronics. The article had first appeared in an East German magazine called
New Times. This magazine is also published in the Russian language and
was picked up in a roundabout way by Missiles and Rockets from Novoye
Vremya, which also means New Times, and was credited by Missiles and Rockets
to a Russian magazine. At any rate, the theme of the article was that the
United States is not very original. The United States manages to make progress
only because of all the foreign scientists its brings to the States. Pobedonostev
was perturbed by this.
Question. Why, in America, do you depend so heavily upon foreign scientists?
Answer. We do not depend that heavily upon foreign scientists.
Question. But for one thing you have many German scientists (rocket
scientists), and also Timoshenko, father of modern structural mechanics went to
America. He was a Russian, as well as the aircraft designers A. P. Seversky
and I. I. Sikorsky, and a number of other experts.
Answer. These are only a small portion of all the scientists In America, many
of whom are not very well known to the general public.
Comment: At this point I began to realize that I was being interviewed by
Pobedonostev. A moment later Stanyukovich came in and was introduced all
around; this temporarily broke up the interrogation. Pobedonostev was not to
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be put off, however, and he even dragged Stanyukovich back into this discus-
sion of scientists from foreign countries being the mainstay of America's
scientific endeavors. He mentioned Dr. Albert Einstein, who was a German,
and nlso the Germans Von Braun and Dornberger, all taken to America.
Frankly, it appeared to me that Pobedonostev, at least, had come prepared to be
the interviewer and not the interviewed. His briefcase was full of Missiles and
Rockets magazines to which he often referred. After the discussion of American
science, he also leafed through pointing out various advertisements. He seemed
particularly interested in this when I mentioned a particular question.
Question. Has any work been done in the Soviet Union on celestial nay!-
gal ion?
Answer. Some work in this field has been done in direction and speed and co-
ordination, but it is all theoretical so far.
Question. Don't you feel that if you were to send men into outer space in a
spare ship hint, a very advanced electronics navigation system will be required?
Comment: At this point, Pobedonostev whipped out Missiles and Rockets
again, leafed through it and found an ad about inertial navigation. He pointed
to the ad and repeated that the work in the Soviet Union is all theoretical so far.
Question. Is there a special course in astronautics? Are students being
trained in specializations directly connected with space flight?
Answer (Stanyukovich). No.
Question. When will a research vehicle be sent to the moon? Is it being
worked on actively?
Answer (Stanyukovich). With the status of U.S. technology and the Soviet
system of Incentive and enthusiasm, we could have men on the moon in no time.
Question, How would you go about bringing together the United States and
the Soviet Union in such a cooperative effort?
Answer (Stanyukovich). It is up to the United States. We are willing to
cooperate.
Question. Butt in what specific way could we go about achieving this kind of
cooperation which I feel would be of tremendous help toward easing international
conscience?
Answer (Stanyukovich). There is too much secrecy in the United States and
also you continue to send Strategic Air Command bombers toward the borders
of the Soviet Union. This is no way to build good will or trust.
Question. But dues not the Soviet Union also have security measures?
Answer (Stanyukovich). Not at all.
Question. You mean that everybody knows what is going on at nil times?
Comment: There was no one answer at this point. All three, Karpenko,
Pobodonostev, and Stanyukovich, emphatically claimed that security does not
exist in the Soviet Union. There is no need for it. Everybody is working for
the common good. There is no rivalry. Two hundred million people own the
state. Scientists, engineers, and workers all hold conferences, argue out prob-
lems, and work together. These three academicians claimed they had not seen
the sputnik firings.
Question. Do you know about the construction, configuration, and method of
the engines used of the final successful launching of sputniks?
Answer (unanimously). That is something the engineers know.
Question. But have you no idea of the type of rocket engines used to launch
the sputniks? Were these engines single engines, engines in cluster, or were
the rockets multistage rockets?
Answer (Pobedonostev). All kind sof propulsion systems were tried. Single
engines, engines in cluster, multistaged rockets, and so forth.
Question. But you do not know which of these was most successful and filially
used?
Answer (StanyukovIch). That is a problem for the engineers.
Question. Has any research work or actual experimental work been done on
full pressure suits?
Answer (Stanyukovich). We have pressure sults.
Question. No, I mean full pressure sults, not partial pressure suits. The type
of suit that would be operative or effective in outer space.
Answer (Dobetionostev). We will develop those types of suits when we need
them.
Question. But bow will you send men out Into space without full pressure
suits?
Answer (Pobedonostev). Dogs will go first into space.
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I Question. But in the United States before we came to the Soviet Union I read
many front page stories in the newspapers about the Soviet Union training a
group of men for a flight to the moon. Could you give me some details about
this?
Answer (PobedonoStev ; he laughs). The whole thing began with a newspaper
story. There was an Italian newspaper reporter here visiting Moscow from
the newspaper Lunita. This reporter tuned in a radio and heared a children's
science fiction story. He thought it was a true report since he had tuned into
the program in the middle of the story. He then went back to Italy and pub-
lished it as a factual story. I myself saw the Italian newspaper, and it was a
front page story. [He laughs again.] It was picked up by the French news-
paper L'Humanite where somehow a picture of one of our pilots was shown.
The caption said that the pilot was launched in a rocket. [All three men
laughed at this point.]
Comment: Stanyukovich then told another story to illustrate .the point of how
newspapers distort the truth internationally. Sanyukovich's story went as fol-
lows : In the German People's Republic, that is East Germany, a paper published
a story last April 1 about five persons already launched in rockets. The news-
paper reporters were influenced namely by their salaries. They felt that they
had to work a spectacular story to keep their jobs. This is true all over the
world.
?? Question. Your sputniks are inclined 65? to the Equator which makes their
orbits almost polar. How were you able to achieve this?
Answer (Stanyukovicia). Just by using a little more power and a little more
speed. .
Question. Could you be a little more specific?
. Answer. We are theoreticians--not engineers.
Question. At the Moscow planetarium not long ago I saw a motion picture
which included a diagram of .a sputnik launching rocket It showed a three-
stags rocket with a group' of rocket .motors in the .first two stages. I believe- I
counted five in the first stage and three in the second. The third was a single..
engine rocket. Ceuld you tell me a little bit more about this?
Answer (Pobedonestev and Stanyukovich).. This was for purposes .iof explana-
tion at the lecture. Those pictures and diagrams were not of the actual rockets
Question. Do you have an absolute program with definite dates for the
launching-of sputniks?..
Answer ( Stanyukovieh). Yes, we da.
Question. How closely to these dates to you come iri your launchings?
Answer. We were 1 year ahead on Sputnik I.
Question..: how do you- explain your ability .to-beat your own.sehedule by such
a great length of time?
Answer (Stanyukovich). It is because of the way things are organized and
the great enthusiasm of the workers who went all out to put their efforts into
this program. Our original plan was to launch the first sputnik at the end of
the International Geophysical Year, but instead we got it up there: first.
Question. How many people were involved in the successful launching of the
first sputnik?..............? '
Answer ( Stanyukovieh) . 170 million people were involved.
Question. But I mean specifically what kind of people; how many propulsion
engineers; bow-many electronic specialists; how many airframe designers?
Answer (Stanytikovich). It is very difficult. The rockets needed to launch
the sputnik are very difficult. One group of people works on the airframe,
another group works on the engines; another on the navigation systems, a fourth
group on the measurements,' the recording apparatus. The fifth group studies
the medical problems. This with the second sputnik and the dog Laika. All
groups are helped by the metallurgist, thermodynamicists, astrophysicists who
are working on cosmic radiation measuring apparatus, and so forth. For ex-
ample: There was one big group. of people working on just transistors alone.
The most qualified people in each field worked on the tasks of the sputniks to
get the answers for the problems and to meet the schedule.
Question. In other words, these people were coordinated in one vast effort
to launch the sputnik?
Answer (Stanyukovich). No, these people worked at the regular electronics
and engineering factories.
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Question: You mean that these were the regular factory and institute workers
that produced the components for the launching of the sputnik as well as the
sputnik itself?
Answer ( Stanyukovich) . Yes.
Question. Didn't this interfere with regular production in these factories?
Answer (Stanyukovich and Pobedonostev). Certainly not.
Question. It would seem to me that if everybody were concentrating on this
one project there would be little time left to do their regular work?
Answer (Stanyukovich). Our workers were so enthusiastic when they learned
about the project that they were working on that they (leveled their spare
time to working on the sputniks. It did net interfere with regular production.
Question. Was there any one person who directed or carried out the sputnik
program?
Answer (Stanyukovich), There was much exchange of opinions and results
between the scientists. From this we got. the best inforinatiou for the produc-
tion of the sputnik. The heads of different Soviets coordinate work in each
field then give the task to each particular plant.
Quttition. What do you mean by Soviets?
Answer (Stanyukovich). Each Soviet is a complete specialized society. By
having all these technological societies coordinated by a greater society they
are able to accomplish what normally might seem impossible.
Comment: All through this interview I was trying to find out about manned
rocket-powered aircraft such as the American Bell X-1, X-2, and the X-15.
And always when I mentioned It, they would deviate and change the subject.
Question. Are Soviet scientists working definitely toward manned space
flight?
Answer (Pobedonostev). Yes, we are working toward manned space flight.
We started this program with the dog Laika in Sputnik II, We had very many
complaints from all over the world about Sputnik II and the dog. From the
United States we received a cable from a woman in Detroit, Mich. She asked
us urgently to save the dog's life.
Question. Well if you have a definite program toward manned space flight
then you must have rocket-powered aircraft?
Answer (Pobetionostev). We have jet aircraft.
Question. No, I know you have jet aircraft. I mean experimental pure rocket-
powered aircraft.
Answer (Pubcdonostev). In 1937 I was the first pilot to fly in a rocket-powered
aircraft.
Question. You flew in a rocket-powered aircraft?
Answer (Pobedonostev). Yes.
Question. But that was in 1937, I didn't realize there was rocket-powered
aircraft then?
Answer (Pobedonostev). This was a small light airplane.
Question. And you flew lion pure rocket power?
Answer (Pobedonostev). It was a liquid rocket.
Question. But was it purely rocket powered?
Answer (Pobedonostev). It was a rocket-assisted aircraft.
Question. No, I do not mean rocket assisted ; I meant pure rocket powered such
as the Bell X-1 series, the X-2, and aircraft like the proposed X-15 in the
United States.
Answer (Pobedonostev). (lie pauses, looks a little bewildered, looks at
S(anyukovich who looks at him and then lie shakes his bead no.)
Question. has the Soviet Union ever experimented with rocket-powered air-
craft such as the Bell X-1 and X-2 series?
Answer (Stanyukovich). We do not believe in such aircraft.
Question. But it is precisely this kind of aircraft that trains pilots in the
rigors of extremely high altitude flights and also, therefore, space flights?
Answer (Pubcdonostev). Such kind of flying is much too risky.
Question. It is a calculated risk. There are many pilots in the United States
who have flown rocket-powered aircraft and for a manned space flight program
such aircraft are, I feel, very necessary?
Answer (Stanyukovich). Littman life is very sacred. We always consider the
safety of the pilots.
Question. But the safety of the pilot is always considered in the United States
too, at Edwards Air Force Base, Calif., where these rocket-powered aircraft are
Bight tested. Every precaution is taken to assure the safety of the pilot:5.
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SOVIET SPACE TECHNOLOGY 11
Answer (Pobedonostev) ? They are very risky aircraft.
' Question. But has the Soviet Union ever experimented with such aircraft?
Comment: At this point Stanyukovich gets very angry?obviously angry?and
starts a long harangue in Russian with Pobedonostev. Karpenko, who has been
sitting in, more or less as moderator on this whole interview places his hand
on the arm of Stanyukovich to calm him down. Pobedonostev is slightly per-
turbed too, but not nearly so much as Stanyukovich. Our interpreter doesn't
translate any of this byplay which goes on for at least 3 minutes, possibly longer.
Question. But I am only trying to find out if, in your space-flight program,
you make use of pure rocket-powered experimental aircraft.
Answer (Pobedonostev, after a long pause). No, we have not.
Question. But you said that you had a definite program with definite dates.
Answer (Pobedonostev). We do.
Question. Then, since physiologically and psychologically, it is most important
to know how a space pilot will act under space conditions, what are you doing
in this respect if you don't have rocket-powered aircraft?
Comment: Stanukovich fidgets angrily again.
Answer (Pobedonostev). We make use of dogs in rockets and sputniks.
Question. But a dog is hardly a substitute for a man in terms of consciousness.
Answer (Pobedonostev). The dogs will lead to the time when we can use men.
One cannot know where he is going until he gets there.
Question. If you don't know where you are going until you get there, then
you must take risks. You claimed that rocket-powered aircraft are too risky for
human life, but aren't such risks necessary for the successful achievement of
space flight?
Comment:? At this point Stanyukovich practically explodes in anger, and
Pobedonostev, himself, who is normally a phlegmatic type gets flustered and also
angry. Karpenko also again has to act as the pacifier for approximately (I
would say) 2 or 3 minutes. There is a big argument between all three with
Karpenko calming both men down.
Question. I think we all agree that the present types of chemical-powered
rockets are quite awkward and primitive, to really explore outer space, not only
within the solar system but among the stars requires new propulsion systems.
In fact even to get to the moon nuclear-powered rockets would be much more
efficient than a chemical-powered one. Does your program in the Soviet Union
include research and experimental work in propulsion methods or systems such
as the nuclear, the ion drive, and the photon drive type of propulsion?
Answer (Stanyukovich) . Some work has been done in the ion drive.
Question. You mean experimental work?
Answer (Stanyukovich). It is theoretical work.
Question. And in the fields of nuclear-powered rockets, has any experimental
work been done?
Comment: There was a pause, and no direct answer. Stanyukovich implied
that work was being done on nuclear-powered aircraft, but completely skirted
the question which dealt with nuclear-powered rockets. I forget his exact
phraseology but this was the general effect. I then asked him the following
question:
Question. In the United States there are companies like Glenn L. Martin who
have set up a research laboratory to investigate the use of gravity itself as a
means of propulsion. The so-called antigravity drive?is there any such in-
vestigations being considered as part of your space-flight program?
Answer (Stanyukovich vehemently). Martin deceives people. The gravity
drive is impossible now. It is a very fashionable thing. One out of every ten
people are interested in it now and I think it is much better to use the quanta
theory, using a gravitational relationship of particle field; the magnetic fields of
particles. I feel that this could be accomplished within a minimum of 10 years.
Question. But what sort of propulsion system is this? What do you mean by
using the magnetic fields of particles, and how would you use them to drive a
spaceship?
Answer (Stanyukovich). I do not know the details; however, Prof. Dmitri
Dmitrich Iva nenko has been working this theoretically: If you would get in
touch with him, he would be able to give you more details.
Comment: To close the interview I reiterated the fact to Stanyukovich that
new types of propulsion methods would be necessary in order to explore the
universe. For the first time in many minutes he smiled and agreed and he made
the following quote: "Yes, the earth is now thoroughly explored. The geog-
raphy of the earth, we can say, is school science. Perhaps within a hundred
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12 SOVIET SPACE TECHNOLOGY
years the geography of the solar system will also be called school science."
Throughout this interview which lasted approximately 3 hours, all three of the
Soviet scientists continually glanced at their wristwatches but were very polite
and patient in answering questions except for the several outbursts of anger on
the part of Stanyukovich, I had the impresaion that they were quite sincere in
their answers but either they didn't know everything I had assumed they knew
or else they skillfully nvvided answering certain questions. The anger on the
part of Stanyukovicia, I believe, was stimulated by my insistence on learning
about rocket-powered aircraft. The interview was concluded after consider-
able small talk following the last question, and once again I became the person
interviewed as they asked molly things about U.S. education and scientific special-
ization. Strangely, Pobedonostev seemed to think that one of the big faults of
the United States was too much specialization and not enough broad knowledge
on the part of the scientists. I pointed out to him that although this was true
of many scientists, not only in the United States but throughout the world that in
the United States we have men like Dr. Fritz Swicky and many others whose
attitude was that all the sciences have an interconnection and that all scientists
should be familiar ns much as possible with all sciences in order to be most
efficient in their own field. Equally strange was the fnct that during our thou-
sands of miles journey through the Soviet Union, no other Soviet scientist ever,
with two exceptions, seemed to agree with Podebonostev's attitude. They were
all for specialization, particularly in engineering.
INTFAVIEW IN MOSCOW WITII ANATOLY GRIGORYEVICTI KARPENKO, SCIENTIFIC SEC-
RETARY OF 'THE PI:101 ANENT COMMISSION ON INTERPLANETARY COMMUNICATIONS
OF THE ACADEMY OF SCIENCES, U.S.S.R.
(Interview by Lloyd Mullan, Amerienn author)
Comment : This meeting look place in the Intourist Service Bureau of the
Savoy Hotel, where we were staying in Moscow. Mr. Karpenko did not, at that
time, invite us to the Academy of Sciences, although originally that is where we
thought we would interview him. Before asking him any questions, I mentioned,
In passing, that I thought Dr. Fred Singer, who is a well-known American physi-
cist at the University of Maryland, and the man who first conceived of a practical
minimum earth satellite, deserved to be awarded the new Russian Theoroskiy
gold medal, The Russian Academy of Sciences, U.S.S.R., dreamed up this award,
which not only included the gold medal but also a small sum of money for out-
standing contributions to space flight on an international Scale. I really believed,
and I still do, that of all the people who deserve such an award, Dr. Singer does.
Mr. Karpenkn nodded vehemently when 1 suggested this. I might add that noth-
ing has ever been done about it. This meeting took place about the third week
of April 1058.
Question. What is your attitude about Dr. Eugene Stienger's photon-driven
rocket?
Answer (n. laugh). Dr. Silenger Ian very groat scientist, lie is of the greatest
In the physics of propulsion, but the photon rocket we will never see in this coun-
try; perhaps a hundred years from now, yes. You know this is my prh-ate
opinion, of course. But in the very close future, 10 to 20 years from now, I
believe the ion rocket will permit man to visit other planets of the solar system.
Question. Why are you so enthusiastic about the Ion rocket and so sure that
It will be feasible in so comparatively short a (line and do not think the proton
rocket will be something feasible for many, many decades?
Answer. The ion propulsion method is tt pet of mine: in fact, I am doing con-
siderable research on this right now. I know it Is feasible.
Question. What would you say would be the maximum time from today that
such a rocket of the ion type could be feasible?
Answer. I will say that the maximum time from now will be no more than
20 years.
Question. Is (here any experimental work being done on the ion rocket at this
moment in the Soviet Union?
Answer. No everything is theoretical right now.
Question. Why, then, if work is only theoretical on the ion rocket in the Soviet
Union, and also the photon rocket is n theoretical thing as well, nod Dr. Eugene
Siienger is energetically doing theoretical work on it In Stuttgart, Germany, can
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you be so certain that in two decades the ion rocket will be feasible and the
proton rocket will not?
Answer. Although no experimental work is being done now on the ion rocket,
such work could begin at any time if the advancement of theory warants it. All
we would have to do would be request a special appropriation for funds.
Question. Fine; but why wouldn't this also apply to the photon rocket?
Answer. At present only theoretical work is possible in this field. There is
no possibility for practical work. To even discuss the photon rocket today
would be like discussing our present working rockets in a technological civili-
zation like that of ancient Egypt.
Question. Well then, Is there any work actual or theoretical going on among
Soviet scientists as regards the photon rocket.
Answer. No.
Question. Regarding pure research types of rockets could you tell me just how
many and what kinds have been developed and are being used in the Soviet
Union.
Answer. There aye two types of pure research rockets in the U.S.S.R.; one is
a small meteorological probe rocket, somewhat like the Aerobee configuration
but launched through a portable launching tower. This is used to investigate
the upper stratosphere, winds at high altitudes, chemical composition of the
stratosphere, and so forth. The other is a very big rocket for ramal, meteoro-
logical, and geophysical research into the ionisphere. It can carry a payload
of VA tons.
Question. Are there any rocket-powered research aircraft in the Soviet Union
such as the Bell X-1 and X-2 series? If so, what experiments have been carried
out with them?
Answer. I have never -heard of any rocket-powered aircraft in the Soviet
Union. I cannot recall any experimental craft like these in use.
Question. But in terms of space medical research, don't you think that pure
rocket-type aircraft such as these that I have just asked you about are in-
valuable for space medical research?
Answer. Your Dr. David Simon's experiments with stratospheric balloons are
much more valuable to space medical research. Simons is a very brave man.
He was up where cosmic radiation might do him harm for a very long time.
Nobody knows now whether damage was done to him or not. It may not re-
veal itself for many years.
Comment: Karpenko's attitude about David Simons was derived from the
paper that Simons gave at the International Congress of the International
Astronautical Federation at Barcelona in 1957.
Question. Has the Soviet Union or the Academy of Sciences of the Soviet
Union ever carried out a series of high altitude balloon experiments such as
those accomplished by Dr. Simon?
Answer. There are none.
Question. Is there any work experimental or otherwise planned?
Answer. No.
Question. Well then, how do you propose to design space suits? Designing
such suits for space-going pilots requires a background of experience in high
altitude physiology?
Answer. When the time comes to send men into cosmic space we will construct
those suits. Then we will call on our background of knowledge and put them
together when we need them.
Question. But how will you acquire this background of knowledge?
Answer. From the dogs that we send into space.
Question. Are there space suits designed for dogs?
Answer. No, there are no space suits designed for dogs. We pressurize the
dogs in their cabins.
Question. You have mentioned that you are acquiring your background toward
the development of space suits through the use of dogs? Is there any special
reason IVhy you prefer dogs? Is it because, for example, I know that their
respiratory systems are the closest to the human among mammals?
Answer. No, it is not because their respiratory systems are very human that
they are used in our experiments. We use them because they have a very high
order of !nervous system.; they respond much more easily to training; they can
be taught to be content to unusual environment. In the United States your
scientists like to use monkeys. Physiologically they are much similar to humans.
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But because of this they are very hard to train to be satisfied so you must
anesthetize them. There is an old Russian proverb which goes. "He who is
soused cannot answer questions." Or another translation, "A drunken man
will give drunken answers." This would be true of drugged monkeys. but alert
dogs can supply many answers about how the nervous system operates in
distress of rocket flight and orbital lightlessness. We are very much interested
in those answers about the nervous system which includes emotions as well as
theological reaction.
Question. Do you plan to ever use any other mammals other than dogs for
future experiments?
Comment : I asked this question because at one time after the launching of
Sputnik II, the American press made a big issue about the fact that the Russians
would next launch an ape in satellite.
Answer. No, we do not plan to use mammals other than dogs for future experi-
ments.
Question. Well what exactly, In terms of psysiological reactions. do you intend
to learn from dogs?
Asnwer. Many things are learned about fear for example: this again requires
conscious mammals. A few days after they return from the rocket flight they
are led into their chainla.r or a similar one. Hy the way they react for or against
being led into this chamber we can fluid out how permanent their original condi-
tioning is and how strong were the negative emotions, or the negative emotional
conditions. Also how much they were conditioned spontaneously by the forces of
the flight itself,
Question. I have read in many places that the Soviet Union was preparing
to send an ape into orbit in sputnik III.
Answer. This was never even considered here.
Question. Well. then. I also have read in a number of reliable American news-
papers that the Aeronautics Research Institute here In Moscow was in the
process of training a group of men. in other words a crew, for the first manned
flight to the moon?
Answer. If we were training such amen now, by the time we would have them
ready they would be much too old to take advantage of their training.
Question. The press, in this respect also in the United States, for a number of
days after you launched sputnik II with the dog Laika, spoke of a recovery
system when the time clinic for catapulting haiku out of the satellite and bring-
ing her back to the earth alive?
Answer (a laugh). This whole story even fooled our own press because they
also published the same story.
Comment : The assistant director of the Moscow Planetarium gave a lecture on
the orbits of sputnik. After he was finished, a newspaperman of our country
asked the lecturer, who by no means was a scientist or a member of the Com-
mission on Interplanetary Communications, whether or not the dog would be
brought back to earth alive. The kindhearted lecturer answered, -Yes, I should
hope so," or words to that effect. It was a personal wish on his part and either
through mistranslation or misquotation it was taken up by the world press
including the Soviet Union.
Question. Well at any rate has any practical work been done on escape
devices or escape capsules, or have any of these been contemplated for the
sputniks.
Answer. Such devices are being worked on but the problem is far from being
solved as yet. When they are solved manned space flight or space flight by
man will be possible.
Comment : Of most of the scientists we interviewed, Karpenko seemed abso-
lutely sincere and spontaneous in all of his answers. There was no hesitation
and, of course. no consultation with any other scientists before he answered.
Question. Why is it that work is going so slow hi the development of an escape
capsule to recover experimental animals alive?
Answer. Such a capsule might easily be greater in weight than the total weight
of the satellite Itself. Much greater thrust will be required of the rocket to
get it aloft, and such thrust is not yet available.
Question. When do you think such thrust may be available?
Answer. Perhaps within 3 to 5 years.
Question. Speaking of the next 3 to 5 years what do you think are more than
just casual possibilities?
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Answer. The following, I believe, are quite possible within the next 3 to 5
years:
1. Recovery of mammals from satellites.
2. Recovery of the satellites themselves.
3. A rocket to pass within thirty-odd thousand miles along the dark side
of the moon.
4. A circumlunar rocket to orbit about the moon for several days.
5. An earthlunar sputnik to orbit between the earth and the moon.
6. Automatic tankettes on the moon's surface (remote controlled crawler-
type vehicles with TV sets).
Question. You are absolutely sure that these are the logical possibilities or the
practical possibilities, lets say, within the next 3 to 5 years?
Answer. It is expected that decisive solutions will be achieved in all of these
fields to from 3 to 5 years.
Question. To continue in another field, in order to achieve a rocket orbiting
about the moon or to send a rocket to the moon the most efficient way to do
this would be a nuclear-powered rocket, would it not?
Answer. Certainly.
Question. How- much research or practical experimental work has been done
in the Soviet Union on nuclear-powered rockets?
Comment: There was no answer here. Karpenko shrugged almost im-
perceptively and began to talk about ion-propelled rockets, which are distinctly
different. I couldn't bring him back to the original question. I brought the
question of nuclear rockets up as clearly as I could, twice. In both cases
Karpenko evaded the issue by talking about ion-powered rockets. I don't think
he Could have misunderstood the Word nuclear. Here are some closing comments
that may be of some interest: One of them is with Proffessor Sedov, we men-
tioned to Karpenko that our time was short. We didn't know whether or not we
could have our visa renewed and it was imperative that we see as many scientists
as possible in the general field of space flight before we left the Soviet Union.
Karpenko, at this point, suggested Federnov (a famous name in the Soviet
Union, by the way). Federov is head .or chief of the Propulsion Institute, of the
Academy of Sciences of the U.S.S.R. Karpenko though, unlike Sedov and others
we later met in the Soviet Union, immediately went to the telephone and tried
to phone Federov so that we could see him the following day. This was 2 days
before May Day, which is one of the biggest holidays in the Soviet Union.
But, nevertheless, Karpenko felt that we could see this propulison expert. He
spoke with Federov's secretary who told him that Federov had some hours earlier
left Moscow for his summer home for the holidays. However, the secretary said
that Federov would return to Moscow immediately after May Day. Karpenko
then told us, after explaining the situation, that he would get in touch with
Federov inunediately after May Day to arrange a meeting. He never arranged
a meeting with Federov but I am sure that he tried to get in touch with him
to do so. Our purpose in this meeting was to shoot pictures at the Propulsion
Institute. Since Federov was the head, he was the only man who could give
permission to shoot those pictures. However Karpenko did subsequently ar-
range for us to see the head of the aviation industry and a top propulsion man,
Stanyukovich, but not Federov.
Final human interest comment: Karpenko was not the least bit self-conscious
except during the first moment of introduction. After that he was relaxed,
voluble, and enthusiastic. He never hesitated to take offered cigarettes as other
scientists did. He smokes as much as I do and once absently withdrew a
cigarette from the pack that I had on the table, lit it, and puffed away while
talking without waiting to have it offered to him. He was that absorbed. He
seemed more businesslike, too, than the others.
INTERVIEW IN MOSCOW WITH LEONID SEDOV, HEAD OF THE PERMANENT COMMISSION
ON INTERPLANETARY COMMUNICATIONS OF THE ACADEMY OF SCIENCES, U.S.S.R.
(Interview by Lloyd Malian, American author)
Continent: We met Professor Sedov in mid-April in the evening. (The next
portion of the tape was accidently erased). Mr. Malian goes on to say that he
met him in an institute of learning of some type within the city of Moscow.
The first question I asked of Professor Sedov was about the status of astronomy
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and astrophysics in the Soviet Union. His answer : The hest instruments are in
tlw United States of America.
Question, How about radio telescopes?
Answer. Those too. The biggest and best instruments. both radio and optical,
are in your country.
Question. Professor Sector. we need your help. This book that we are working
on. we feel that it is exceptionally important to international understnnding
and good will. Would it be possible for you to arrange for us to visit a research
missile test renter?
Answer. No problem Ithrtmgh tlw interpreter].
Question. Would It also b,n. possible for ns to make photographs of research
rocket vehicles. Not necessarily military but ones that would be used in pure
research?
Answer. No problem.
Question. Would it be possible to interview people working on these projects,
because one of our points is to humanize science in Russia to the American
public?
Answer. Of course. [Question by Professor Sedovl. What sort of people
would you like to interview?
Answer (Mr. Malian). Astrophysicists, astronomers, engineers in the fields
of propulsion and airframe design, space biologists nod other aeromedical re-
search scientists, and electronic scientists as well RS electronic engineers. That
is, theoreticians as low as practical designers in the field.
Answer. We can arrange this. No problem.
Comment : Professor Sedov very carefully noted on a little pad that he carried
each of the types of scientists and engineers as well as physiologists that we
wanted to see. He not only carefully made the list, but he added a note when
we mentioned that of ull these fields to us the field of aviation 11Wdleillt" was
of prime importance and in every ease his answer was-- -no problem: that he
would arrange it.
Question. We would also like to tithe ithotographs at the Institutes of the
Academy of Sciences such as the Institutes connected with the subjects we
have mentioned?like neromedical research center, propulsion research center,
and the aviation lust itute.
Answer. This can be arrtInged
Comment : As Professor Sedov made the list (I used the word designer) he
said. -Oh, yes, you would like also to bilk with one of our engineers." He
mentioned this because I had used the word scientific worker to include both
engineers and theoreticians in the general field of space flight.
Question. Professor Sedov. we have met Dr. Eugene &tenger in Stuttgart,
Germany, who is working on proton propulsion for rockets. What is your
attitude toward proton propulsion?
Answer. The proton rocket is a fiction of science. There is no foundation of
fact to it.
Question. But, Professor Sedov, isn't It true that all great achievements in
science are the result of visionary scientists who, ahead of their time, dove into
areas like that of Dr. Siienger's?
Answer. Actually the answer here was a kind of shrug. I persisted.
Question. But would you say that the proton rocket is completely Impossible?
Answer. Perhaps in 50 years it may be possible. There are many things, all
complicated. that must he accomplished first. There will first have to he atomic
electrical plants all over the world. And, of course. Dr. Slimmer believes the
Proton rocket is possible. He lots to believe it.
Question. Professor Sedov. could you tell us anything shout your forthcoming
sputnik launching. which will be No. 3?
AllSWer. Nothing will be known about that or other sputniks until they are
working. It is of no interest to talk about .them until they are successful.
Question. But today the sputnik program is the most interesting part of your
space-flight endeavors, is it not ?
Answer. Yes.
Question. Well, then. couldn't you at least extrapolate Into the future.
Answer. A shrug of the shoulder.
Continent : The fact that many trade and technical magazines, as well as
reliable newspapers in the I.-nited States such as the New York Times had men-
tioned that the sputnik prcgrtult in the Soviet Union had been instigated by the
Aero Club. The Central Aero Club of the Soviet Union had proposed
these earth satellites.
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Question. How did it happen that the Chkalov Aero Club (the Chkalov Central
Aero Club of the U.S.S.R.) began their promulgation for a program to launch
earth satellite vehicles?
Answer. The Clikalov Aero Club did not instigate the space-flight program.
Question. Who did, then?
Answer. The Academy of Sciences of the U.S.S.R.
Comment: In conclusion I would like to summarize the interview with Pro-
fessor Sedov. The entire interview lasted about 21/2, perhaps 3, hours. In the
process there was much small talk, of course, such as Sedov making quite a big
issue of the fact that the Academy of Sciences of the U.S.S.R. after the launch-
ing of Sputnik I, had received thousands upon thousands of letters, as he put it,
from people all over the world requesting that they be granted the right to act as
volunteers to be sent up into orbit in the next sputnik, which would be Sputnik II.
But the most important thing of all to us was the fact that Sedov implied?not
exactly?he stated. It wasn't merely an implication. When we asked him to
dinner that evening, he said that he had other things to do, but that within a
few days he would be very happy to have dinner with us. The thing that was
implied in other statements he made before we left him, was that we would be
seeing him very often and that he would work with us to the best of his ability
to help us achieve a great humanized picture of Soviet science, in terms of
bringing out international good will and better understanding. Professor Sedov
took from us a list of 60 Soviet scientists that we had prepared over a period of
months in much research. He checked off the names of the scientists on that
list who would be most pertinent to our project which was a project devoted to
the field of space flight, which included all allied fields: Electronics, guidance,
missiles, rockets?the whole business. And of the 60 he checked off approxi-
mately 35 names (as I recall now) and said that he would get in touch with all
of these people. We never saw Professor Sedov again nor did we ever hear from
him again by note or telephone; however, we spent approximately 10 days trying
to get in touch with Professor Sedov ourselves. First using ordinary channels
( that is, using our intourist guide and interpreter) and then even using devious
means. We had met some Russian students who spoke English. One of them
phoned a number of times for us representing himself as a Government official.
At no time were we able to reach Sedoir ; although every time at his three offices,
secretaries there took notes and later when we phoned back said they had
delivered those notes. There were two exceptions to the list of about 35. Sedov
did get in touch with Alla Masevich, to whom we had a letter of introduction
which we had mailed to her at the same time we had mailed our letter of intro-
duction to Sedov. She had never phoned us until the day after we spoke with
Sedov, so I assumed that he had spoken with her as he said he would. The
other exception was Karpenko, scientific secretary of the Permanent Commission
on Interplanetary Communications of the Acadbmy of Sciences. Karpenko
phoned us saying that he would see us approximately 10 days after we saw Sedov.
MEMO
To: Committee on Science and Astronautics.
From: Lloyd Malian.
Subject: List of scientists and VIP's who gave me letters of introduction to their
colleagues in the Soviet Union.
1. Dr. S. Fred Singer, associate professor of physics, University of Maryland
,:to Prof. Leonid Sedov, head of the Permanent Interdepartmental Commission
on Interplanetary Communications, U.S.S.R. Academy of Sciences).
2. Dr. John W. Evans, superintendent, Sacramento Peak Observatory of the
Geophysical Research l)irectorate, Air Force Cambridge Research Center (gen-
eral letter to Soviet Academy).
3. Dr. Richard E. Shope, of the Rockefeller Institute for Medical Research (to
Prof. Viktor M. Zhdanov, U.S.S.R. Deputy Minister of Health and a specialist on
viruses).
4. Dr. Armand N. Spitz, inventor of the Spitz Planetariums and head of U.S.
Moonwatch program (to "whom it may concern").
5. James J. Harford, executive secretary of American Rocket Society (to Prof.
Yevgeny Federov, chairman, Soviet IGY Committee for Rocket and Satellite
Research).
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6. Mr. Andrew G. Haley, general counsel of American Rocket Society and at
the time president of the International Astronautical Federation, of which the
Soviet Union is a member nation (24 letters of introduction, including the presi-
dent of the U.S.S.R. Academy of Sciences. Nesineyanov. the presidents of the
Academy of Sciences of the Kazakh 5.5.11. and Ukrainian S.S.R.. as well as
Mr. Khrushchert.
7. Dr. Eugen Slinger, director of the Forschungsinstitut Fur Physik Der Strab-
inntriebe at Stuttgart. West Germany. and a world-renewned authority on rocket
impulsion (to Professor Sedov, mentioned above).
Nom.?Altogether. as I recoil, I carried with me to the Soviet Union about 33
letters of introduction, some of the above persons having given me both specific
and general letters of Introduction.
Mr. A NFUSO. Mr. Chairman.
The C11.1 IR NT N. Mr. Anfuso.
Mr. ANruso. May I add to that, Mr. Mallan ? Would you mind
putting into the record the names of the Russian scientists you inter-
viewed?
Mr. MALL% N. I have a typewritten list of 38 of those scientists I
interviewed.
Mr. ANrrso. Will you put that in the record, also?
Mr. MAMA N. I certainly will.
( The list of Russian scientists is as follows:)
LLOYD MALLAN INTERVIEWS?LIST OF SOVIET SCIENTISTS
Leading scientists
Prof. Leonid Sedov. member of the U.S.S.R. Academy of Sciences and chair-
man of the Permanent Interdepartmental Commission on Interplanetary Com-
munications of the Academy.
Prof. Alia Masevich, assistant director of the Astronomical Council of the
Academy and head of the sputnik ?laical tracking program.
Anatoly GrigoryevIch Karpenko, scientific secretary of the Commission on
Interplanetary Communications of the Academy.
YUFI Pabecionostsev, professor of sciences at the Moscow Aviation Institute
and member of the Academy of Sciences.
Kirill Stanyukovich, professor of gas dynamics and chairman of the mathe-
matics department, Moscow Technological institute, also member of the Academy
Other ciciztits
2
Lev Viktorovich Zhigurev. expert in radio location techniques and coordinat-
ing editor of the popular science magazine, Znanlye-Sila (Knowledge is Power).
LENINGRAD
Leading scientists
Prof. Alexander A. Mikhailov, director of Pulkovo Observatory, correspond-
ing member, Academy of Sciences of the U.S.S.R., and chairman of the Acad-
emy's Astronomical Council.
Prof. Met' Chebotarev, director of the library, Leningrad Academy of Sciences,
corresponding member of the Academy of Sciences of the U.S.S.R., and the
scientist, who calculated the trajectories of rocket for Project Boomerang. the
Russian plan to send a sputnik around the moon.
Other scientists
Vladislav Sobolev, solar astronomer at Pulkovo Observatory.
Alexel Kisselev. astronomer at Pulkovo Observatory.
Andrei Marino, astronomer at Pulkovo Observatory.
Dmitri Shuhegolev, astronomer in charge of sputnik tracking at Pulkovo
Observatory.
ODESSA
Leading scientists
Prof. Vladimir Platonovich Tsesevich, director of Mechnikov Observatory
and corresponding member, Academy of Sciences of the U.S.S.R.
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Other scientists
Yuri Rousseau, astronomer at Mechnikov Observatory.
THE CRIMEA
Leading scientists
Prof. Andre Severny, director of the Crimean Astrophysical Observatory and
corresponding member, Academy of Sciences, U.S.S.R.
Peter P. Dobronravin, assistant director, Crimean Astrophysical Observatory.
E. R. Mustel, head of the IGY Committee for the U.S.S.R.
V. B. Nikonov, stellar physicist, in charge of the stellar division at the
Crimean Astrophysical Observatory.
Arnold Stepanyan, head of cosmic ray research at the Crimean Astrophysical
Observatory.
Other scientists
L. S. Galkin, scientific secretary at the Crimean Astrophysical Observatory.
Nikolai Steshenko, solar physicist at the Crimean Astrophysical Observatory.
Benjamin Mojerin, head of sputnik tracking at the Crimean Astrophysical
Observatory.
S. A. Savich, head of ionospheric and earth magnetism research at the
Crimean Astrophysical Observatory.
ARMENIA S.S.R.
Leading scientists
Prof. Viktor Ambartsumyan, president of the Academy of Sciences of Soviet
Armenia, director of Byurakan Astrophysical Observatory, and corresponding
member of the Academy of Sciences of U.S.S.R.
Torgom Yessayan, assistant director, Armenian Academy of Sciences, and well-
known philosopher.
Doctor of Sciences Ludvig Mirzoyan, scientific secretary of the Armenian
Academy of Sciences.
Other scientists
Ramela Shahbazian, scientific worker at the Byurakan Astrophysical Observa-
tory.
Harutjunyan, scientific worker at the Byurakan Astrophysical Observatory.
KAZAKHSTAN S.S.R.
Leading scientists
Dr. Kanysh I. Satpeyev, president, Academy of Sciences of the Kazakh S.S.R.
Academician Alexander P. Polosukhin, director of the Institute of Physiology
of the Kazakh Academy.
Academician Vasily Fesenkov, director of the Astrophysical Observatory of
the Kazakh S.S.R. and corresponding member of Academy of Sciences of the
U.S. S. R.
Prof. Dmitri Rozkovsky, astrophysicist at the Kazakh Astrophysical Observa-
tory.
Prof. Gavril Tikhov, head of the Department of Astrobotany of the Kazakh
Academy and corresponding member of the Academy of Sciences of the U.S.S.R.
Dr. Mihad Karimov, assistant director of the Astrophysical Observatory of
the Kabakh S.S.R.
Dr. Zoya Koragina, astrophysicist at the Astrophysical Observatory of the
Kazakh Academy of Sciences.
Dr. Nikolai Divai, astrophysicist at the Astrophysical Observatory of the
Kazakh S.S.R.
Other scientists
Eugene Federov, scientific worker on the sputnik tracking camera at the
Kazakh Astrophysical Observatory.
Andrei Kharitonov, astrophysical scientific worker at the Kazakh Astrophysical
Observatory.
Mr. ?SINTERS. Mr. Chairman.
The CHAIRMAN. Mr. Osmers.
Mr. OSMERS. How long were you in the Soviet Union on this
mission?
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Mr. MALLA N. TWO mouths.
Mr. OsmElls. Thank you.
Mr. MALLAx. And I traveled 14,090 miles in the process during
which I was able to notice a lot of things. If you are alert and
looking for si ecific. things, you can see things that the average person
would not know was there.
Mr. TEAct-E. Why, Mr. Malian, do you think they allowed you to
t ravel those 14,000 miles?
Mr. MALLAN. It was not easy. They resisted me on the itinerary
for about 3 weeks, but it was finally a bit of bureaucracy and luck on
my part that turned the trick. If you want to hear the explanation,
it will take a few minutes. But the reason for the. distance and these
various localities was that the head of the Soviet optical tracking
setup, Prof. Alla Masevich was kind enough to phone and write.
personal letters to astrophysicists that she knew plus the fact that I
had already paid in advance for an open voucher before going to the
Soviet. The fact that Masevich had arranged for me. to see certain
astrophysicists plus the fact that the Soviet intourist Bureau did not
know quite how to cope with an open voucher finally solved the. prob-
lem with me.
It was a combination of luck andstubbormtess really.
Mr. Ft-uros. Considering your research, your trip to the Soviet
Union, your consulting with Soviet scientists as well as other scientists,
and the other in you have been able to get up to this date,
would you give us your considered judgment whether the shot an-
nounced by the Russians on Friday, January 2, 1959, was or was not
a hoax? If you will answer yes or no, please.
Mr. AIALLA N. I am sorry. I did not quite. follow that in terms of
the positive and negative answer. I think it was a hoax. I know, in
fact, as far as I know, it was a hoax.
Mr. Fut,Tox. As a result of all your investigations RS well as your
trip to Russia, your consultations with Russian scientists, with Ameri-
can scientists and any other research you have done, at the present
thne you say definitely it is a hoax.
Mr. MALLAx. That is right ; yes, sir.
Mr. Fut:pox. Thank you.
Mr. OSMERS. Mr. Chairman.
The Ci 'AIRMAN. Mr. Osmers ?
Mr. OSMERS. I wonder if the witness would tell us whether he was
able to convince any American scientists who thought it was not a
hoax. Were you able to convince them that it was a hoax after you
had presentea material similar to the material you are presenting
here?
Mr. MALLAx. If, by scientists, you also include tracking experts?
you know, technicians such as radar specialists and microwave special-
ists?I can answer that 'Armin ively ; yes.
Mr. OSMERS. -Well, since you have made the distinction, I will have
to question about the dist inction.
Where would you draw the line between the tracking technician
and the scientist in this case ?
Mr. MALLAx. Well, the difference is a formal one. A scientist has a
degree; a tracking technician may know just as much and not have
a degree.
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Mr. OSMERS. Well, I will narrow the question down. Were you
able to convince any of the scientists any of those men that had degrees,
that it was in fact a hoax when they originally believed otherwise ?
Mr. MALLAN. I was able to have them reverse their judgment and
admit that there was a reasonable possibility that it was a hoax.
Mr. OSMERS. You were able to?
Mr. MALLAN. Yes; I was.
Mr. ANFUSO. Mr. Chairman.
The CHAIRMAN. I promised to recognize Mr. Wolf here for a
moment.
Mr. WOLF. Mr. Chairman.
Why do you think, Mr. Malian, that because you were in Russia and
because you visited with these particular technicians that they told
you everything? Now I was in Russia. I traveled several thousand
miles, too, and I came away in 1957 with the strong feeling that they
had told me some things but they surely had not opened up everything
for me.
Of course, I was not concerned with technical matters and I have no
reason to believe that because you went there and because you visited
with them, that they gave you everything.
Mr. MALLAN. Well, as an experienced science reporter, I asked
them the kind of questions that they had to answer honestly. I did
not, for instance, ask them, "Do you have, an intercontinental ballistic
missile?" Instead, I asked them for the focal length of their tracking
cameras and the type of lens arrangements. I asked them about their
electronic guidance systems and I also closely inspected the equipment
in both of these fields that they very proudly showed me, and this
equipment was primitive.
I took photographs of it and I have at least proof photographs of
these along with me.
Mr. WOLF. Well, I had the feeling after my trip to Russia, that
what they wanted me to do was to come home and lull people to sleep
in this country with a false sense of security about our superiority
in the technical field. I am wondering if this is not what they wanted
you to come home with as a great technician, as a great scientist in
this field.
Mr. MALLAN. I am not a great scientist. I am a science reporter.
Mr. WOLF. Well, you presented facts in your magazine that would
be designed to
Mr. MALLAN. A science reporter. And all reporters should be able
to present facts, as these reporters see them.
Mr. WOLF. I will rephrase the statement and say you presented
ideas of your own that will be accepted by many people in a sense of
lulling the American people. to sleep. This is the. question I ask.
Mr. MALLAN. The article also included facts. For example, Prof.
Alla Masevich, a very noted astrophysicist in the Soviet Union and,
as I mentioned earlier, is chief of their whole sputnik optical track-
ing setup, took me up on the roof of the Sternberg Astronomical In-
stitute, which is the astronomical section of the Academy of Sciences
of the U.S.S.R., and showed me their tracking camera. She was
extremely proud of it. It was a modified Red air force aerial
camera, with a WAF 2.5 lens, It had a fairly wide angle. It was a
decent camera but it was extremely "old hat" stuff' and not at all effi-
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cient. She mentioned to me, when I asked her about a newer type of
camera, that they were working on one and she told me where they
were doing this work.
-I later went to Leningrad at Pulkova Observatory and spoke with
Prof. Alexander Mikhailov. He is in an even higher position with
the Academy of Sciences of the U.S.S.R. since he is chairman of the
Astronomical Council and director of Pulkova Observatory, which is
the coordinating observatory for the entire Soviet Union.
He told me that, yes, Maksutov, their famous optical expert, has
been working on an F-1 camera.
He said?and you will find it, in the tape recorder transcript?be-
cause Professor Mikhailov spoke English and I recorded the con-
versation?he said, yes, we are working on an F-1 camera which is
quite like the ones you have; you know. Our super Schmidt Baker
Nunn camera that was built for our optical tracking system through-
out the Western Hemisphere.
They kind of astounded me because two sputniks had already been
launched and at, that. time I believe. we had launched only one satellite,
Explorer 1, successfully. We had this terrific, predesigned, advanced
setup of a radio and optical tracking system interlocked, tied in with
computing centers so that we were notonly able to follow and fore-
cast the positions of our own satellites, but we were the ones who gave
the Soviets the orbits for their satellites.
This, in itself, %%hen I learned it, was a shock to me. But. I can
understand why we had to give them the orbits after I Saw their track-
ing equipment.
Professor Masevich told me that. the equipment she showed me on
the roof of the institute was used at every key satellite tracking sta-
tion in the Soviet Union.
I visited six of these key stations, spread over a distance of 10,000
miles, I would say, and in every case they were using this same "old
hat" obsolete type of aerial camera.
Mr. ANFrso. Mr. Chairman.
The CHAIRMAN. Mr. AllfUSO.
Mr. ANFUSO. Mr. Chairman, I think that in order that we can
properly evaluate Mr. Mallan's testimony, we ought to first offer for
the record his story "The Big Red Lie." I think that, should be
printed in the record. I think we ought to do that first, and then I
have another question to ask.
The CHAIRMAN. If there is no objection, the. story will be printed
in the record at-this point.
(The. True magazine reprint. of "The Big Red Lie" follows:)
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lEIRATE
0
The Big Red
LIE!
THE MAN'S MAGAZINE Russia Tries Biggest
Hoax In History!
33e MAY I9SO A FAWCETT PUBLICATION
The
BIG RED LIE
Confidential Advance Material
Not For Release Or For Public Information
Until Monday, A. M., April 20, 1959
28
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Aiggroved For ReleaS1912004A78/431 TEIAIRDIRBST00245R000100290011-7
The BIG RED
TRUE Cormipondent thred Mallets (darn ohms in an relreviets teeth Fro). Alexander leading Soviet as
monomer) it a mums wiener writer :reporter, ilse author of Inintletnir teleatlfii books. Armand SIAM. head of the VS.
Alsontrateh program mils Mallon 'a expert, Magma, anislyit and irtimpreter.. ." Dr. Fred Singer, designee of the first
femaste earth satellite, intradiam Malian as "a 'deuce writer fif ruse talent." indent, Flaky, peeddent of the ham
notional Astronautical Federation, SC). of Malian: "Ile it oxe of the frith great resters:heck
By LLOYD MALLAN
rioFeiday. January- 2. 19.59, the Sosiet Union an
nounted that it had successfully launched a rocket
unsaid the Minn_ The RUISIJris also alainsed that this
roam. 'ibith they dubbed subsequently went
into orbit Around the tun.
This was a monumental triumph of propaganda. In one
shattering blow, it wiped inst the elects on world opinion
r4 three great Anutican achiestincritc the too Pioneer
rockets that had nosed farther into spate than anything
pressmsly nude by man, and the delicately inutunsented
ttlas satellite that had opened a ne-n, rei Of lernfCrthlAnte
communisations The world seas agog_ U.S. scientists
writhed in thagrin and admiration_ President Eisenhossii
himself. in a heroic thaw of spoirunsanship. .4feeed the
kremlin his genuine congratulations
In for Ilse, I was stunned.
In those btu odd NAM. alit, the RuMan announie?
mrnt. I walked around in a nightmare I was laced with
EtrArnst choKr between two fantastic peopositi.ois
Neither seemed acceptable. hut somehow. I han to atom,
The first propeuition an that onsething out wrong
with me, that in some nedathimuble was I had been led
into a celeseat error of Judgment. The .mond proposition
was, simply, that the Russian moon rorket did not mask
few months before. I had teaseled 14.000 miles through
Russia on a tetentific reporting espedition. I had talked to
24 of the top Sosim stienteus?far more. I'm udd, than any
oilier Western jrnarntaiisa has mer been lucky enough to
reach I had seen Maine Satire son...mattes, research ren-
ters. orssert.rtntirs. Seemingly eager to hate me rake home
a glowing report of their progress. the Russians had
proudly shown me the cream"( their techniilintital achieve.
ntents I had looked and Wenn! carefully. I had formed
inflaming', tested them and re trued them.
And I bad come nut of RU.Sir with the dead. Rat cer-
tainty that the United Suites was immeasurably far ahead
In 'spare technology?auk for one thing. R111Sial had no
Arta, intercontinental balliolt missile: and that. for
another, the U.S. would beat Attraill to the 'moon without
half laying.
Rut here I Nona nn the esening ni Januar.. 2. Russia's
epit Announrement ringing loudly unfitl mockingly in my
ears. I poured myself a drink and sat down. I unsaved but
through the note. And ripe recordings and photographs
And meIrrof les id nu Russian journey. Rut no matter how
I silted And re esaluated. I couldn't make it add up. Es cry
C./.4,4 /Pit Ia.,/ P./M.4./ hst
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Left, Alla 51assevieh, leading lady of Soviet astronomy,
watches an aide demonstrate best Russian aerial camera for
Author Malian. Compared to $100,000 U.S. tracking cameras
(above?which can photograph a golf ball at 1,000 miles) die
best Russian satellite tracking equipment appeared primitive.
This qualified observer, after 14,000 miles behind the Iron Curtain says:
1. The Soviet Union's first man-made planet, "Lunik," does not exist and never did.
2. The Russians do not have any ICBMs, the long-distance terror missile with which
Khrushchev has threatened this country
thing I'd seen and heard in Russia argued against the
alleged fact of Lunik. The scientific community which I
had studied in that enigmatic land was not capable?
simply not capable?of producing any such thing.
It was a hard concept to gvasp, both intellectually and
emotionally. But this was it. The Russians did not fire a
rocket past the moon on January 2, 1959. If they fired
anything, it failed to reach the distances achieved by the
U.S. Pioneers. The Lunik, in shoo, was a coolly insolent,
magnificent, international hoax.
I couldn't just let the incredible thought ferment in my
brain, of course. I went to Washington. talked with mili.
tar) men and intelligence officers in the Pentagon. I visited
Project Space Track, the Air Force installation in Massa-
chusetts that collects and correlates tracking data from all
over the Free World. I telephoned major tracking stations.
I talked with scientists.
Not one of them would make the flat statement that lie
had heard a signal from Lunik. Officially, the U.S. was
acknowledging the existence of Lunik. Unofficially and
privately, the net cold edge of doubt was beginning to
seep into some clever minds.
Slowly, this doubt emerged into the open. Puzzled little
essays began to appear in newspapers. Syndicated
columnist Fulton Lewis, Jr., for instance, wrote on
January 21 that "intelligence sonrces" were question.
ing Russia's veracity. An editor of the magazine Elec.
(sonic News ran an exhaustive probe of the affair
through correspondents arenind the world, ended
convinced that no Lunik exists. Ile couldn't print his
conviction, however; his publisher feared repercus.
PRESIDENT EISENHOWER;
"We seem very prone to give 100.),,
credence to some statement of the
Soviets, if it happens to tomb upon
our own anxieties... Apparently
they are believed all around
the world and ton implicitly."
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The BIG RED LIE
Mom ordered merely another vaguely ismakd ems.
Thew men are on the uml id the hg Red Lie. but un-
fortunately they must piece the story together 111/111
shedows on this side of the Iron Curtain. Them nmrtually
no more ehante of getting any useful leads Inside Rustle.
for the Kremlin is now undoubtedly an guard to protect its
lie. I nu lucky enough. though. to get the story before
Lunik. I taw ROEra and talked to Mania Kiting.. as a
KKK when there KM no Lunik boas Ii. worm
In my notes and picture. and tape recording, there is.
I submit, solid evidence that no such win .orbiting room?
and no effective Russian ICILM--could or Ems exist.
I arrived in Runia one mar ago this month. In my tug
gage were ham Ili top Sot its Korman laser their taunter
parts in LI.S rience?rnen such aa pbyskiat Lk. S. Fred
Stager .14 the Unisenity .4 Maryland. gilti Mari OKI find
seriously polkaed an earth satellite and showed that the
idea was leatible. These letter, asked the Russians tat or
operate with nu, identified rue a, a minted Kiernan
nbserver and author of wientifit boas. and stated my
minion as that ol bringing home an obp-ttike and, pre.
GENER.4L LESLIE GROVES.
former air' arise Manhattan
have always been
skeptii al of the report. we Sr
arise on Russian prawns in
Kiernib: tospincering and will
remain so until there is free
mina scram the ham Comae'
Rosario my this deft) is lannk and white splotch
(abort) is rocket's mdium Aare. Author Mallen
brands both Runianeelemed photographs a. fakes.
surnably. nattering report on the state of Singel Kleine.
The whole idea of this mission sat well with the Russians.
lin they are politically committed to brag. Ta a huge
munt. the sumen of Communism depends OR the mums.
of Communia propaganda in winning the world'. admire
MM. 1ra01 Premier lihruduhev down to the lowliest newt
paper bad. Russians gate no opportunity to tell the world
of their every achievement, I fitted into this effort very
nkeh. Iliac I was: an .Amerkan kienee journalist. all
starrveyed. eagea 111 add nil IfOite 10 the admiring chorus.
I really was As I entered Russia that spring. I was hilly
prepared to be overwhelmed by art impression of tre-
mendous tedinological magma.
ties the Russians know this, and they welcomed me. I
hate no other explanation for the fact that 1 was allowed
to talk with or many key teirmis.. tat tee so much of what
previously had been obscured. American news correspond-
ems velum I met in MOKOR gaped in disbelief when
dvmml them the gin of Russians I planned to interview.
They told MT MAI they randy. if ever, get to see a Soviet
+minim of any note. Mak of their strafe news is spooned
Mit in Milli by Soviet press harems It isn't hard to gum
why, these ate hard-digging revirterk and the Kremlin
kart thews I. ern the other hand, wey billed as a man so
full of awe and admiration that I'd mallow whateser was
handed me.
IRMO gni, the SOVIget geornmsent travel bureau. assigned
an intellimot. moderately pasts girl named Natasha as
my interpret. and guide. I told her that the fir. Min I
wanted to re was Pod. Leonid Soho, head of the Perma-
nent Interdepartmental COMMliniM Oil Interplanetary
(.ommuntcations ft..., space travel) of the So. ict Academy
tif Sciences. As over-alt ton ol the Russian spare program.
Seeks had two things that I needed badly: (1) the locations
and plume numbers ol other important scientists and (2)
the porter to help me. of not help me. get in touch with
them. There are no phone books avaibble to the public
in Runk. and it is very. very hard to tract down key men
ROWDY( help- Mod/ Impossible-
Seib., a big man with thick rimless glanes, was as oblig
ing as a salesman with a bat prospect. I asked ill could
Imsk in on be, research proketa EH course I mold. Could
interview people working in the spare program/ Cm-
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Amateur photographer in Scotland took this picture of a
light in the sky after Lunik "launching." London papers
said bright area might be a flare, but experts disagree.
Small Russian radio telescopes such as this were said to have
picked up signals "loud and clear" from Lunik, whereas...
... giant U.S. Air Force instruments like this one (lef a) had
no success in locating any trace of the fugitive Red rocket.
Lunik mystery deepened when world's largest radio 'scope
at Jodrell Bank (below) reported failure to track rocket.
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Author Mallen, right. and girl interpreter char with ascrophyskin Prof. Gbh Cheboure. (wand from left) and aide.
The BIG RED LIE
tainly. Gould 1 photograph rode.? Sure thing. I handed
him a lin of the top men hoped to visit Would be tell
me where these people were and ustackh the way for me to
we them? He nodded amicably. jotting reminder, to him
self in at. notebook_ It could all be arranged. No problem.
Obviously. then. the Russians intended to show me
things, send me reeling back to my howl dauled by scenes
of mighty foams and pioneering experitstenta Mentally.
I shrugged. It was art morptabk bargain If they wanted
to put on a show for me, rd give it bonen mimes when I
got home.
But almost as mon as the curtain went up. I armed that
something was wrong,
One of IlTy key intertiews was moth a man who. at far Al
GENERAL NATHAN F.
TWINING, Chairman of the
Joint Otief. of 511111 tommenting
oat Kt:26Mo Defense Ntinitter
Matincoaky's amertion that So-
viet kellittic rocketa can pin-
IMAM their turts, hal mid
lad) that he &rem% believe
the Red claim.
GENERAL BERNARD
SCHRIEVER, chief of dst Air
Forte ballistic missile division,
when naked sebether be accepted
Rsunian boa_sts about ics)r.,
mid -1 don't believe the
Bode Union now bas an opera.
tion al long range mimic ready.'
I know, had never before talked with a Western reporter:
Prot Gleb Chekotarev, director of the Institute of Theo-
ret oaf ASII00011ty in Leningrad. C.Iwbotarev is one of Rut
sia's top mathematical :monomers In the months before
ra come to Russia, he had been widely touted in the Soviet
mess as the head of "Project Boommarig," a planned effort
to tend a rocket around the moon. According to these
report*. Project Boomerang RAY well along; the Russian
MOM. rocket would be launched quite mon.
Cletwitaret was J bespectarled. amiable, middle-aged
man: he looked the way astronomers look is. the movies
1 aged him how dose his project was to its goal.
He shrugged 'I cannot my." be said. "I have not yet
been approached by the engineers."
Trying not to look nartbd. I tubed: 'At any rate, your
project h being wriorsdy considered for future on?"
"Right nose this is only theoretical work.'
'Too MGM to OBI that no engineers hare read your cal-
=lath:ens and at lean commented on Maar
Ghetto-tare, tended. "If Miry have, they have not let me
know. I do not Wink they believe in my sanity.'
It was a shock. All along. pictured the Boomerang
'trope' 31. a =MAC center alive with busy meet, designs
ing drawn. components arriting, maybe a launching pad
being made ready. Instead, it tinned out to be a middle-
aged prolevair in an boll tower. The propagandists had
grabbed a little weed of lam held a magnifying glass up to
it and made it look like a tall tree.
I win badly Julien. but I tried to lode it. I trent on with
more question, Rehire coming to talk with Chrtotarev
I'd read over tome newspaper elippings on him, and I now
remembered a fragment from the New. York Timel. The
Tenet was quoting Irmo a ittiliCIAP NtliiJ story on Boom-
erang: 'The increase it a rocket'. speed from the 18,000
mph already achieted (by the Sputniks) to 25.000 mph to
that it can escape the earth's gravitational pull is 'perfectly
possible at the prevent nage of technical development.?
naked Ehebotarev about the problem of speed. Said he:
'It will be a 'Try great jump from eight to eleven kilome-
ters ? second. I do not know when it will be possible for
them to do it'
Another slunk. 1 sat there and hacked at Chebourev.
trying to Exalt it lot, lie wasn't lying to toe. Why Mould
he? When the whole tommuniu prologanda machine wat
loaning rammed) about the coming nation shot, why
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should this one scientist suddenly try to play it down? If
he was going to lie, he'd have lied in the other direction;
hail have told me how the rocket was poised and ready
to shoot.
I could only conclude he was telling the truth as lie knew
it. Ile was a scientist. Scientists are rigorously trained
against falling into the trap of exaggeration; they make
statements cautionsly. They know that, in their business,
a inan's professional reputation can (Alapse overnight if
lie's caught saying misleading things about his work.
Then I wondered: wouldn't Sedov have foreseen this?
Sedtiv, or whoever else was masterminding my journey?
Wouldn't Ile have realized that, in sending me to see scion.
tists. Ile wax sending me to see truth? Maybe init. Maybe
Ice believed the propaganda himself, or maybe lie felt cer-
tain that the scientists, being Russians, would loyally back
up the Big Red Lie.
Or maybe, 1 thought, maybe there's a moon shot under
wraps somewhere, allti (:lICLOHITCV just doesn't know about
it. But this didn't stand up. One of Russia's top astroini.
niers, a well-known expert in celestial mechanics, kept in
the dark abont Soviet space activities?
I put out another probe. 1 remembered reading an
article in Znoniye-Si/a (tran)lation: Knowledge is Power),
a leading SOViet science magazine. The article dealt with
Clichotarev's lab, and it Said ill part: "By means of huge
automatic computing ma( hines, this Institute is engaged
in calculating the precise movements of the earth, moon,
and planets ..."
I said to Cliebotarev: "Pelhaps you can give me some
information regarding your electronic computers?"
Chebotarev said: "1 :1111 not atquainted with these ma-
chines. Inc my kind of work the electronic machines are not
needed. All my calculations are made Icy another professor
with the help of small electrital calculators."
It was unbelievable. Not Znaniye-Sila's exaggeration,
which was remarkable enough, but the fact itself. In the
U.S. today, electronic computers are 100% essential both
to theoretical astronomy and to the nuts-and-bolts work
of spare travel. Even small research shops use computers?
scramble for them, rent them partAime when there's no
other way to get them. Yet one of Russia's best astro.
physicists is "not acquainted with these machines."
I wanted to read more about Soviet computers. I knew
that a good place tirclo so was at Moscow's Tei lin ical Book.
store, the one place in the city where scientists, technical
people and students can buy their specialized hooks. In this
store, I reasoned, I'd find descriptions of the most up.to-
date Soviet equipment.
I sneaked in Wil.110t1l. Natasha, for I didn't want to give
her too many clues to the direction of my thinking. I have
only a minimum knowledge of the Russian language, hut
mathematical and scientific symbols?and, of course, pic-
tures?know no language barriers. In books with 1957 and
1950 publication dates, I found diagrams and photos of
primitive electronic machines such as those used in America
back in the early 1950's. In the fast-moving computer bush
ness, six or seven years add up to a long, long time. Com-
pared to what IBM and Remington Rand are producing
today, those old machines were [Continued on page 102]
EDITOR'S NOTE: Next month TRUE Corre-
sponden+ Lloyd Mallen will reveal Other Big Lies
which he discovered in Russia. Be sure to read his
revelations on the myths of Soviet air power.
48438 0-59 3
ANOTHER RED LIE...
e.14
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/
U N I VAC
FIRST CHOICE OF INDUSTRY AND GOVERNMENT
Remington Rand Univac ad ran October 24, 1955.
Pfe 414.Llep 1..av